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Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

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Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I believe that one of the most underappreciated skills in business is the ability to string a coherent narrative together. I attend many meetings with extremely-talented engineers who are incapable of presenting their arguments in a manner that others (both technical and non-technical) can follow them. Yes, but the arguments they need to present are not necessarily the ones they used to convince themselves, or thei…

To give a brief example of this -- a college asked why an exec had listened to my argument but not theirs recently, despite "saying the same thing". I explained that my argument contained actual impacts: actual delays, actual costs, an actual timeline when the impact would occur -- rather than nebulous "there will be problems". Everyone comes to execs with hypothetical problems that all sound like people dressing up…

I don't know. Predicting delays, costs and timelines is notoriously hard unless it's something you've done the exact same way many times already. For example in physical work, like installing external insulation on a building, a contractor can fairly easily predict the time required because they did similar buildings in the past several years, it's multiplying an area by a time average, and they know the delay caused by asking for some material by checking the shipping time on the website they order it from.

Developing software is very different and many nontechnical execs still refuse to understand it, so the clever engineers learn to make up numbers because that makes them look good.

Realistically, you simply come across as more competent and the exec compressed all that talk about the details into "this guy is quite serious about not recommending going this way - whatever their true reason and gut feel, it's probably okay to go their way, they are a good asset in the company, I trust that someone who can talk like this is able to steer things to success". And the other guy was "this guy seems to actively hide his true reasons, and is kind of vague and unconfident, perhaps lazy or a general debbie downer, I see no reason to defer to him."

Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cycling, in my experience, is usually way more intense than walking or even running/jogging. It just lets you cover larger distance and gives you more control over how your energy is used. With the example of LLMs, sure, you could cycle the initial destination you were meant to walk to - write an article with its help, save a few hours and call it a day. Or you could cycle further and use the saved time to work on so…

If we're nitpicking, are we talking about cycling as a sport or cycling as a means for getting from point A to point B? I'm sure cultures where they cycle to everywhere all the time take it easier than cultures where going out for a bike ride is an event.

Not nitpicking, just playing along with the analogy, which i found not that far fetched

Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#244
post #226

It feels, more and more, that LLMs will be another technology that society will inoculate itself against. It's already starting to happen in education: teachers conversing with students, observing them learn, observing them demonstrate their skills. In business, quickly I'd say, we will realise that the vast majority of worthwhile communication necessarily must be produced by people -- as authors of what they want to…

Sad reality is that most people are not smart. They’re not creative, original, or profound. Think back to all the empty and pointless convos you had prior to AI or the web.

I don't see it as sad, it's perfectly fine to be mediocre. You can have a full, rich life without being or doing anything extraordinary. I am mediocre and most of the people I know are mediocre - at least mediocre in the sense that there will be no Wikipedia page under my name.

Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> One of my favorite developments on the internet in the past few years is the rise of the “I don’t think/won’t think/didn’t think” brag posts Sorry, I can't immediately think of what you're talking about. Could you link to an example so I can get a feel for it?

Every time you have ever seen somebody weigh into an evenly slightly complex topic with a post that starts with “I asked chatgpt and”

That just signals to me to completely ignore the rest of what they wrote.

Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To give a brief example of this -- a college asked why an exec had listened to my argument but not theirs recently, despite "saying the same thing". I explained that my argument contained actual impacts: actual delays, actual costs, an actual timeline when the impact would occur -- rather than nebulous "there will be problems". Everyone comes to execs with hypothetical problems that all sound like people dressing up…

I don't know. Predicting delays, costs and timelines is notoriously hard unless it's something you've done the exact same way many times already. For example in physical work, like installing external insulation on a building, a contractor can fairly easily predict the time required because they did similar buildings in the past several years, it's multiplying an area by a time average, and they know the delay caused…

I think there's an element to that -- I also said it's about trust and credibility. However in this case it was partly about helping the exec cognise the decision and be aware that he needs to make a decision, basically scaffolding the decision-making process for the exec.

It's kinda annoying for decision-makers to be presented with what sounds like venting. This is something I've done before, in much worse ways actually -- even venting on a first-introduction handshake meeting. But I've learned how to boil that down into decision-making.

I do find it very annoying, still, how people are generally unwilling to help you explore your thinking out-loud with you, and want to close it down to "what's the impact?" "what's the decision?" -- so I sympathise a lot with people unable to do this well.

I often need to air unformulated concerns and it's a PITA to have people say, "well there's no impact to that" etc. : yeah, that isnt how experts think. Experts need to figure out even how to formulate mental models of all possible impacts, not just the ones you care about.

This is a common source of frustration between people who's job is to build (mental,technical...) models and people who's job is to manage social systems.

Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#247
post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In business, quickly I'd say, we will realise that the vast majority of worthwhile communication necessarily must be produced by people I believe that one of the most underappreciated skills in business is the ability to string a coherent narrative together. I attend many meetings with extremely-talented engineers who are incapable of presenting their arguments in a manner that others (both technical and non-techni…

I find that LLM extremely good in training such language skills by using following process: a) write a draft yourself. b) ask the LLM to correct your draft and make it better. c) newer LLMs will explicitly mention the things they corrected (otherwise ask for being explict about the changes) d) walk through each of the changes and apply the ones you feel that make the text better This helped me improving my writing sk…

Done this as well. But after the initial "wow!" moment, the "make it better" part became a "actually I don't like how you wrote it, it doesn't sound like me".

There is a thin line between enhancing and taking over, and IMO the current LLMs cross it most of the time.

Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#248

It feels, more and more, that LLMs will be another technology that society will inoculate itself against. It's already starting to happen in education: teachers conversing with students, observing them learn, observing them demonstrate their skills. In business, quickly I'd say, we will realise that the vast majority of worthwhile communication necessarily must be produced by people -- as authors of what they want to…

Shallow take. LLMs are like food for thought -- the right use in the right amounts is empowering, but too much (or uncritical use) and you get fat and lazy, metaphorically speaking. You wouldn't go around crusading against food because you're obese. Another neat analogy is to children who are too dependent on their parents. Parents are great and definitely help a child learn and grow but children who rely on their pa…

Shallow take.

Your analogies only work if you don't take in to account there are different degrees of utility/quality/usefulness of the product.

People absolutely crusade against dangerous food, or even just food that has no nutritious benefit.

The parent analogy also only holds up on your happy path.

Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not about getting it right, its about having thought about it. Authoring means thinking-thru, owning, etc. There's a tremendous hollowing-out of our mental capacities caused by the computer science framing of activities in terms of input->output, as-if the point is to obtain the output "by any means". It would not matter if the LLM gave exactly the same output as you had written, and always did. Because you stil…

http://thecodelesscode.com/case/122

Hey, this is actually good, and the whole site is as well. Thanks for sharing!

Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#250

It feels, more and more, that LLMs will be another technology that society will inoculate itself against. It's already starting to happen in education: teachers conversing with students, observing them learn, observing them demonstrate their skills. In business, quickly I'd say, we will realise that the vast majority of worthwhile communication necessarily must be produced by people -- as authors of what they want to…

Shallow take. LLMs are like food for thought -- the right use in the right amounts is empowering, but too much (or uncritical use) and you get fat and lazy, metaphorically speaking. You wouldn't go around crusading against food because you're obese. Another neat analogy is to children who are too dependent on their parents. Parents are great and definitely help a child learn and grow but children who rely on their pa…

> You wouldn't go around crusading against food because you're obese.

My eateries I step into are met with revulsion at the temples to sugary carbohydrates they've become.

> about 40.3% of US adults aged 20 and older were obese between 2021 and 2023

Prey your analogy to food does not hold, or else, we're on track for 40% of americans to acquiring mental disabilities.

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