Live data from Hacker News

Me an' Algernon – grappling with (temporary) cognitive decline

tidyfirst.substack.com

21–30 of 79 posts

Re: Me an' Algernon – grappling with (temporary) cognitive decline

#21

> When I re-read Flowers for Algernon recently I was just sad. The second half of the story, where his mind is going away, is just brutal, especially when he can remember how smart he was but knows it's gone for good. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21544149 "Von Neumann would carry on a conversation with my 3-year-old son, and the two of them would talk as equals, and I sometimes wondered if he used the same pr…

> In this late stage of his illness, he must have been aware that this capacity was deteriorating rapidly, and the panic that caused was worse than any physical pain.

I watched my father go through this (due to Alzheimer’s) before he passed away. He would say “I don’t understand why I just can’t think like I used to”. It was heartbreaking. He was a brilliant mathematician before the disease put him in a mental prison. It was pure torture for him.

Re: Me an' Algernon – grappling with (temporary) cognitive decline

#22
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am actually just starting to go on medical leave from work due to this My performance has been going down, my anxiety and stress are through the roof. Honestly you wouldn't know it from talking to me, other than the fact my memory is shot I'm completely forgetting stuff minutes after it happens I'm very unhappy with the feeling, and I hate going on leave for this, but I have to. I'm not even 40 and this is the seco…

This happened to me during the pandemic. High (insupportable) stress, plus a year or two of significantly too little sleep, plus social isolation. It was terrifying. I had just seen my mom taken by Alzheimer’s (or something similar) way too young, and thought my life was over. All the tests coming back negative, making a point of hanging out with friends, returning to the office, and getting enough sleep seemed to he…

I am somewhat the opposite. The pandemic was great for me. Being able to work remotely is wonderful. Much less stressful than commuting daily, more free time, less scrutiny during work hours and I don't live alone so staying home isn't isolating

I definitely do need to spend more time out of the house with friends and such though

Most of my current stress is due to AI fears, layoffs looming, uncertain about the future job market for my skills, and such. Definitely too little sleep

I think I'm too young for Alzheimer's to be a serious concern but it does run in the family so it might be worth asking my doctor about it. I hadn't thought of that

I really do think that it's mostly a combination of my company having like 6 rounds of layoffs in the last couple of years, plus them turning up the pressure to use AI as a daily driver now.

I've been trying but I just cannot get the productivity out of it that other people are claiming. Makes me feel obsolete

Edit: I also can't really wrap my head around my coworkers who are gleefully embracing AI tools after watching the company cut literally half of our development team over the past couple of years.

It makes me feel like I'm watching chickens sharpen the farmer's axe

Re: Me an' Algernon – grappling with (temporary) cognitive decline

#23

> When I re-read Flowers for Algernon recently I was just sad. The second half of the story, where his mind is going away, is just brutal, especially when he can remember how smart he was but knows it's gone for good. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21544149 "Von Neumann would carry on a conversation with my 3-year-old son, and the two of them would talk as equals, and I sometimes wondered if he used the same pr…

Watching my grandmother slide helplessly into the dark mental abyss of dementia and then be lost inside it for years made me realize that it is downright inhumane to not offer end of life assistance to people.

Re: Me an' Algernon – grappling with (temporary) cognitive decline

#24
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt you can cure these diseases, you can perhaps prevent them, but to cure would mean removing their effects, and if you could remove their effects and say, bring a seriously deteriorated Von Neumann back to his previous mental heights it seems like you should be able to make anyone the equal of Von Neumann - which I agree would be a great thing to be able to do but seems to be a much further along than the words…

> I agree would be a great thing to be able to do but seems to be a much further along than the words cure or prevent would indicate. If the words "cure" or "prevent" don't indicate that, why did you bring it up? :) I think this is being needlessly pedantic. Keeping in mind that one of HN's guidelines is to respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of a comment, I think we can assume that GP meant, essentiall…

The "disease" we're talking about here is death. Von Neumann was losing his mental capacity because he was dying. I know some in the silicon valley set think that "curing" death is both feasible and desirable but I disagree on both points.

Re: Me an' Algernon – grappling with (temporary) cognitive decline

#25

> When I re-read Flowers for Algernon recently I was just sad. The second half of the story, where his mind is going away, is just brutal, especially when he can remember how smart he was but knows it's gone for good. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21544149 "Von Neumann would carry on a conversation with my 3-year-old son, and the two of them would talk as equals, and I sometimes wondered if he used the same pr…

Watching my grandmother slide helplessly into the dark mental abyss of dementia and then be lost inside it for years made me realize that it is downright inhumane to not offer end of life assistance to people.

I have conflicting feelings on it

On one hand, I had a similar experience with my grandfather. He eventually couldn't even remember to speak English, he reverted to his childhood language. When we translated, he thought I was a childhood friend of his, not his grandson. It was awful

But sometimes he would be so lucid and remember everything. It was so awful thinking that "he is still in there" the idea of him choosing to end it and not have those last few times to talk.. I dunno

During one of those lucid times was the most deep and important conversation I ever had with him. He understood what was happening and it gave him the freedom (courage?) to talk about things he'd never talked to me about before. It was so important to me as a young man, I cannot imagine if he had signed an end of life form and I never got to see that side of him before he passed

Selfish of me I know. But still. Maybe this really just highlights how important it is for people to really talk to one another when they are alive

Re: Me an' Algernon – grappling with (temporary) cognitive decline

#26
post #6
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now keep in mind that that frustration - the absolute torture of losing who and what you are - applies to everyone going through something like this, not just the greatest minds of their time. Makes me glad that we're starting to look at assisted dying more seriously...

why not try to cure alzheimer or other mental diseases that show up on the elderly instead?

Do you genuinely believe that this is a binary decision, or is this just anti-euthanasia rhetoric disguised as concern trolling?

Offering humane end-of-life options to people suffering today does not prohibit ongoing disease research towards potentially helping people in the future.

Re: Me an' Algernon – grappling with (temporary) cognitive decline

#27
I was in a car crash and spent a month in the hospital where they gave me heavy-duty pain killers. I could tell I was having cognitive issues because I couldn't remember words that I knew I used before, but I wasn't curious about it.

After a while they halved the prescription and after a few hours I could feel my words returning. It was terrifying to feel my IQ rise substantially. Before I left eh hospital they gave me various cognitive and mental tests and it was reassuring to be told that I was in the 96 percentile of my peer group (college educated, engineers)

We deal with a parent with dementia and another with a stroke. The difficult part with all of these are not really seeing the decline from the inside, sometimes there are the acknowledgment of hints of decline but mostly you don't want to think about it and compensate as best as you can.

Re: Me an' Algernon – grappling with (temporary) cognitive decline

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Watching my grandmother slide helplessly into the dark mental abyss of dementia and then be lost inside it for years made me realize that it is downright inhumane to not offer end of life assistance to people.

I have conflicting feelings on it On one hand, I had a similar experience with my grandfather. He eventually couldn't even remember to speak English, he reverted to his childhood language. When we translated, he thought I was a childhood friend of his, not his grandson. It was awful But sometimes he would be so lucid and remember everything. It was so awful thinking that "he is still in there" the idea of him choosin…

> I have conflicting feelings on it

As ardent a supporter of assisted death as I am, I really don't think there's any other way to feel about it. You illustrate exactly why these types of choices will never be easy.

Re: Me an' Algernon – grappling with (temporary) cognitive decline

#29
I've had cognitive decline over the past 6 years. I turn 41 this year. It's strongly (maybe solely) due to stress, anxiety, depression, migraines, and insomnia. This entire clusterfuck started 6 years ago because, while I had the skills to excel in school and career, I was sorely lacking in the skills to be a father, husband, and homeowner. When I got married and we began having children, my decline began. But it was slow enough and normal enough at first (new parents often don't get enough sleep, they often have extra stress and anxiety, etc) that I did nothing to combat it. It wasn't until 2021 with all the added awfulness of 18 months of a global pandemic that it become obvious things were unsustainable. I was barely able to function at work, I was being put on a PIP, and I was almost completely absent from my family. When I was with my family I was irritable, angry, constantly complaining.

I got on antidepressants and that helped, though it came with it's own set of problems. I started seeing counselors, reading self-help books, I went through 6 months of cognitive behavioral therapy for insomnia (CBTi), working with a neurologist to get migraines under control, seeking help wherever I could. It has been a slow process but I'm doing a lot better. I'm still nowhere near where I was cognitively. In fact I don't know that has improved much at all. And it's only been in the past year that I've began to understand my decline as a result of jumping into marriage, fatherhood, and home ownership without the necessary skills to handle them. I'm hopeful things will continue to improve, I've learned an enormous amount about life, fatherhood, marriage, love, forgiveness, hope, and priorities.

If you are a young parent, or considering being a parent soon, work on yourself. Ensure you have the skills you need or your life (and the lives of those near to you) will become a bag of utter despair filled with shit.

Re: Me an' Algernon – grappling with (temporary) cognitive decline

#30

I was in a car crash and spent a month in the hospital where they gave me heavy-duty pain killers. I could tell I was having cognitive issues because I couldn't remember words that I knew I used before, but I wasn't curious about it. After a while they halved the prescription and after a few hours I could feel my words returning. It was terrifying to feel my IQ rise substantially. Before I left eh hospital they gave…

Heavy duty pain killers tend to do that but it's temporary.

I remember having a particularly nasty dentist visit after which I kept myself stuffed with a painkiller i hadn't head of, on her instructions. Then going to the corner store and forgetting why I went there.

Permanent cognitive decline is another, much sadder, topic.

Post reply on HN