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Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

latimes.com

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Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#221

Post by api »

bumby wrote: post #167
api wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The blunder is choosing only two and including Boeing at all. It should be SpaceX, Rocket Lab, and Blue Origin, and maybe soon Stoke Space.

Were you prescient enough to claim that at the time of the contract or only in hindsight? At the time, most thought Boeing was the safer bet.

I haven't thought Boeing was a good bet pretty much ever, or maybe not since the 1990s but I was a teenager then.

Boeing has been on the same path to decline as old GE was for decades.

Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#222

Post by Whoppertime »

labster wrote: post #201
davidw wrote: post #31

Well, yes, that's the point. Authoritarians want to consolidate power and loot wealth, not improve things or make the world a better place.

Americans want looting and authoritarianism, so that’s what they’re getting. There’s no excuses here after a majority of people voted for Trump’s return, with his repeated promises that he wouldn’t be held back this time around. We got exactly what we voted for — worldwide tariffs, sending the military to round up migrants, a military parade with tanks in DC, antivax boards — all of these things he talked about befor…

It's hard to hear people complain about looting and authoritarianism after watching these same people calling BLM mostly peaceful protest, and had no problem with the authoritarian policies passed during the COVID lockdowns https://fee.org/articles/george-floyd-riots-caused-record-se...

Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#223

Post by rockemsockem »

bumby wrote: post #194
rockemsockem wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And that was good because... Why?

It would potentially mitigate the risk identified by the GGP regarding “unreliable” contractors who force risks on you that you may not want. Same reason I often choose to do house maintenance myself. Not to say it’s also not without costs/risks, it just comes down to which balance you prefer.

NASA still makes these competitive contracts though and picks among several contractors. Afterwards NASA is still involved in design through reviews and other lines of communication.

Using your analogy, if I do hire a contractor I'll talk with them a lot about what they're going to do and make sure it's generally in line with what I want, but they're generating most of the ideas and just incorporating what I say.

Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#224

Post by angrysaki »

xedrac wrote: post #209
davidw wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you read about Maduro wanting to imprison the leader of a region of Venezuela, who belongs to the opposition party, you'd call it authoritarianism. If you read that the Secretary of Defense of Turkey declined to commit to obeying court orders, you'd call it authoritarianism. If you read about Viktor Orban sending actual troops rather than police to a city because of a flimsy pretext, you'd call it authoritarianism…

You're ignoring the massive elephant in the room. The previous administration let millions and millions of completely unvetted and undocumented immigrants into our county, creating an unprecedented crisis. I view Trump's actions as reclaiming our country from the brink. All of the instances you mentioned are simply fallout from the crises Trump was handed, and it astonishes me how liberals cannot see this simple fact…

What are the symptoms of this "unprecedented crisis" and what makes it a crisis?

Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#225

Post by const_cast »

h3lp wrote: post #133
whatshisface wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You think you could fundraise billions of dollars for science from private sources? You're talking about a $100B (spread out over the next decade) bill on the sidewalk. I don't think there's anything less realistic than the idea that there would be that amount of money available for the asking but unclaimed...

Well, historically, we used to have a robust industrial R&D that even did basic research: Bell Labs (astrophysics, semiconductor physics), IBM, Xerox, RCA, Kodak and many other; even Ford had an R&D lab with physicists. Their record was quite impressive, as we all know. The weird trick that made that work was a tax policy that supported that. IIRC, R&D was expense as opposed to amortization, together with a laxer tru…

Well all those companies are dead now... so... clearly spending all that money on research didn't really pan out for them.

Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#226

Post by 0xbadcafebee »

LiquidSky wrote: post #208
0xbadcafebee wrote: post #190

Leading with "Trump" just makes it political/ideological. People need to stop making "the personality" the center of these discussions, because people who like him will just like whatever he does, and immediately disagree with you. Focus on the issue instead and people have to debate on merits rather than ideology.

He’s the President of the United States and the one (officially) making these decisions. It’d be absurd not to include him in talking about these issues.

I think you could very easily debate the merit of such a cut without talking about who proposed it. If you can't talk about the issue without talking about who proposed it, it's likely you don't actually care about the issue itself.

Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#227

Post by Loughla »

leptons wrote: post #177
fzeroracer wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the big problems of having a government ran by an oligarchic gerontocracy is that none of the people in charge are going to care about long term effects because they'll be dead before it affects them. So they maximize short term value extraction and destruction. It's not strictly a far right issue either, the dems are feckless and useless for similar reasons being that any sort of long term consequences does n…

> the dems are feckless and useless for similar reasons being that any sort of long term consequences does not matter to them. Please elaborate on this.

Old. They're old. Gerontocracy means old people. Dems, republicans, both are old.

The average age for republicans and democrats in the house is 57 or so. The average in the senate is 62(r) and 65(d).

While 57 isn't ancient, it's also not young enough to give a shit about 2070. 62 and 65 year olds certainly don't care about a date so far in the future that their kids will be dead.

Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#228

Post by pstuart »

vlod wrote: post #188

The All-In-Podcast recently interviewed (1-1) Jared Isaacman (NASA admin nominee) about the bloat. Worth watching the whole interview ~1 hour. [0] Jared Isaacman: What went wrong at NASA | The All-In Interview https://youtu.be/6YdOjoaQTOQ?si=FUeL8mJ6LwHwO_B4&t=1275

There's no doubt that there's waste and inefficiency, but it would be nice if it was addressed by parties who are not hostile to the enterprise as a whole.

The concept of a "DOGE" would be wonderful if it actually focused on efficiency of government spending rather than cover to destroy all ideological enemies.

Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#229

Post by rockemsockem »

pu_pe wrote: post #83

The US is actively choosing to become completely reliant on private providers for access to space, which at this point boils down to SpaceX and Boeing. Both seem unreliable for different reasons. I just cannot see it as anything else than a blunder.

Sorry how is SpaceX unreliable?

I personally think we need at least a second reliable launch provider, probably rocket lab, just for redundancy.

Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#230

Post by umbra07 »

labster wrote: post #201
davidw wrote: post #31

Well, yes, that's the point. Authoritarians want to consolidate power and loot wealth, not improve things or make the world a better place.

Americans want looting and authoritarianism, so that’s what they’re getting. There’s no excuses here after a majority of people voted for Trump’s return, with his repeated promises that he wouldn’t be held back this time around. We got exactly what we voted for — worldwide tariffs, sending the military to round up migrants, a military parade with tanks in DC, antivax boards — all of these things he talked about befor…

> Americans want looting and authoritarianism, so that's what they're getting. There's no excuses here after a majority of people voted for Trump's ret with his repeated promises that he wou be held back this time around.

Why do you think it's appropriate to say "Americans want..." and "We got exactly what we voted for..." when only 32% of Americans voted for Trump?

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