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Why Koreans ask what year you were born

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Re: Why Koreans ask what year you were born

#201

Post by subarctic »

throw55653s2 wrote: post #165
socalgal2 wrote: post #53

This "high power distance" culture contributed to several airline crashes in the 80s and 90s because people under the captain wouldn't dare to question the captain's decisions. One in particular: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Air_Flight_801

That sounds like pop science. I find it funny culture is used to describe why things fail in Asia, but when things fail in the West, it’s because of that individual person‘s actions.

Kind of makes sense when you think about it, since if the person is describing it in English at least there's a good chance they are from the West.

Re: Why Koreans ask what year you were born

#202

Post by agubelu »

blargthorwars wrote: post #124
anthk wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Spaniard here; addressing someone by the last name looks really outdated.

As a tourist, it's a cheat code to be hyper formal. Gets you instant goodwill.

Spanish has actually three levels of formality when addressing someone by name:

: Informal, casual conversation.

Don : More formal, conveys respect while still indicating some closeness.

Señor : Most formal, normally used in writing.

Using only someone's last name is just plain weird. If you want to speak formally to someone just address them as "usted", it will get you the same goodwill without sounding off.

Re: Why Koreans ask what year you were born

#203

Post by OJFord »

A not dissimilar age thing I've found interesting is from India: it is (or can be? Big country) typical to age yourself by the year of life you're in, i.e. 1-based rather than 0-based, basically.

On his birthday my grandfather in law said 'I am x years old! [...] Oh, no, x-1 complete.'

It's funny these kinds of arbitrary systems for things we have, and never question, until you suddenly stumble into one that's slightly different.

Re: Why Koreans ask what year you were born

#204

Post by tdeck »

dkga wrote: post #173

I find it surprising actually how much these seniority rules are well-defined in many cultures, but in Brazil there is strong variation - even in the same geography. For example, a colleague who is learning Brazilian Portuguese was under the impression that "você" and "tu" were the equivalent of "vous/tu" or "Sie/du". In reality, they are just different regional ways of saying the informal you. In Brazilian Portugues…

> Another example many people outside Brazil find interesting: in my family we were taught to never use the formal towards anyone. The rationale is that everyone is equal and that using the formal language was disrespectful because it created an artificial distance between us and the other person. We were also taught never to use the formal language when praying for the same reason.

Interestingly this is why Quakers continued to address people as thou/thee long after everyone else abandoned the practice. Thou was originally the "informal" second person singular pronoun in English, "you" was plural. People used "thou" (the familiar form) in conversations with God. People used "you" as a singular pronoun to be polite. Eventually, "you" overtook thou.

But the Quakers believed that using "you" to show respect was anti-egalitarian and resisted the trend for a long time.

Nowadays because "thou" appears a lot in the King James Bible it tends to be associated with formal, archaic language, so if anything the connotation is the reverse.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thou

Re: Why Koreans ask what year you were born

#205

Post by anthk »

agubelu wrote: post #202
blargthorwars wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a tourist, it's a cheat code to be hyper formal. Gets you instant goodwill.

Spanish has actually three levels of formality when addressing someone by name: : Informal, casual conversation. Don : More formal, conveys respect while still indicating some closeness. Señor : Most formal, normally used in writing. Using only someone's last name is just plain weird. If you want to speak formally to someone just address them as "usted", it will get you the same goodwill without sounding off.

Don it's very outdated unless you address a very important person.

Re: Why Koreans ask what year you were born

#206

Post by gen220 »

k07b470n wrote: post #113
valenterry wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fair enough. > Since then you are allowed to write it either way Okay, my interpretation is that it doesn't really make sense within the language rules, so they changed it but allowed to use the old style to make the transition easier. ;-) > I still use the capitalized form because I'm old and that's what I learned back in school. Impossible to keep up with all the Rechtschreibreformen anyways.

Thank you and nosebear for the clarification! Now I understand better why some of my colleagues (like my boss, older) use "Du" and some don't. I'll stick to not using it, there are enough grammatic pitfalls elsewhere in the German language (not that French is any easier for foreigners, I'm sure).

I love and hate German for this; it's a language whose formal pitfalls and vagaries seem almost designed to sort people into highly-refined strata of education.

It must be so cool to see all of them "from the top" (i.e. someone who has been natively-and-highly educated, immersed in the language for their whole life); but it's from the outside it's like a fancy club that you just can't seem to get into :)

Re: Why Koreans ask what year you were born

#207

Post by tdeck »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #84

I'm surprised they ask for the year directly. My impression is that in China, if you want to know someone's age, you ask for the animal of their birth year. That gives you the year mod 12, which you're expected to be able to resolve to a particular year yourself.

I've read that it's considered perfectly OK to ask someone's salary in China, so it's interesting that asking a person's birth year would be sensitive.

Re: Why Koreans ask what year you were born

#208

Post by agubelu »

anthk wrote: post #205
agubelu wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Spanish has actually three levels of formality when addressing someone by name: : Informal, casual conversation. Don : More formal, conveys respect while still indicating some closeness. Señor : Most formal, normally used in writing. Using only someone's last name is just plain weird. If you want to speak formally to someone just address them as "usted", it will get you the same goodwill without sounding off.

Don it's very outdated unless you address a very important person.

I agree it's more likely to be used by older generations but it's not uncommon to hear it around either, especially when addressing or refering to elders

Re: Why Koreans ask what year you were born

#209

Post by kwillets »

Leftium wrote: post #114

Koreans have some "hacks" to get around this (age-based) social hierarchy: 1. Some workplaces use English names (and even English language) so co-workers can speak/refer to each other without using the social hierarchy constructs built into the Korean language. 2. Social (partnered) dance clubs go by nicknames for the same reason. Even though I dance with them on a regular basis, I don't know most of my dance friends…

Kakao ended the English names a year or so ago due to inevitable confusion, but now people are supposed to add the "nim" (dear) suffix to each other's Korean names instead, which sounds creepy.

The funny part of the Kakao CEO asking to be called Brian is that there was a K-drama (Search WWW) with a fictional tech company, but they also made the CEO name Brian. I suspect if this idea had gone on every CEO would be called Brian.

Re: Why Koreans ask what year you were born

#210

Post by xenadu02 »

In the USA as a low-level employee address the company CEO as "heya phil, hows it going?". Then address your friend with "Hello Mr. Smith". In most cases you won't get a positive reaction out of either one of those (yes exceptions exist).

How about this: address your husband/wife as "Mr/Mrs ", especially after a fight. Similarly when the kids have been doing something or you are frustrated with your partner say "your son did X".

Every language has explicit and implicit rules for expressing honor, respect, and closeness. Informal systems can vary more often and be more fluid but they always exist.

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