Live data from Hacker News

What happens when people don't understand how AI works

theatlantic.com

41–50 of 359 posts

Re: What happens when people don't understand how AI works

#41
post #9

What really happens: "for some reason" higher up management thinks AI will let idiots run extremely complex companies. It doesn't. What AI actually does is like any other improved tool: it's a force multiplier. It allows a small number of highly experienced, very smart people, do double or triple the work they can do now. In other words: for idiot management, AI does nothing (EXCEPT enable the competition) Of course,…

Perhaps, the higher-ups are so detached from details that they see a comrade in the LLM bullshit-artist.

Re: What happens when people don't understand how AI works

#42

> Few phenomena demonstrate the perils that can accompany AI illiteracy as well as “Chatgpt induced psychosis,” the subject of a recent Rolling Stone article about the growing number of people who think their LLM is a sapient spiritual guide. Some users have come to believe that the chatbot they’re interacting with is a god—“ChatGPT Jesus,” as a man whose wife fell prey to LLM-inspired delusions put it—while others a…

Crazy people will always find a way to be crazy. It’s not surprising that many of these cases have a religious nature to them.

Re: What happens when people don't understand how AI works

#43

> Few phenomena demonstrate the perils that can accompany AI illiteracy as well as “Chatgpt induced psychosis,” the subject of a recent Rolling Stone article about the growing number of people who think their LLM is a sapient spiritual guide. Some users have come to believe that the chatbot they’re interacting with is a god—“ChatGPT Jesus,” as a man whose wife fell prey to LLM-inspired delusions put it—while others a…

I'll admit, the first time I started ollama locally, I asked it if I would hurt it if I turned it off. I have a master's degree in machine learning and I know it's silly, but I still did it.

Re: What happens when people don't understand how AI works

#44
post #18

I agree with the substance, but would argue the author fails to "understand how AI works" in an important way: LLMs are impressive probability gadgets that have been fed nearly the entire internet, and produce writing not by thinking but by making statistically informed guesses about which lexical item is likely to follow another Modern chat-tuned LLMs are not simply statistical models trained on web scale datasets.…

> produce writing not by thinking but by making statistically informed guesses about which lexical item is likely to follow another

What does "thinking" even mean? It turns out that some intelligence can emerge from this stochastic process. LLM can do math and can play chess despite not trained for it. Is that not thinking?

Also, could it be possible that are our brains do the same: generating muscle output or spoken output somehow based on our senses and some "context" stored in our neural network.

Re: What happens when people don't understand how AI works

#45
post #15

This is a good summary of why the language we use to describe these tools matters[1]. It's important that the general public understands their capabilities, even if they don't grasp how they work on a technical level. This is an essential part of making them safe to use, which no disclaimer or PR puff piece about how deeply your company cares about safety will ever do. But, of course, marketing them as "AI" that's ca…

People are paying hundreds of dollars a month for these tools, often out of their personal pocket. That's a pretty robust indicator that something interesting is going on.

I'm not disputing the value of what these tools can do, even though that is often inflated as well. What I'm arguing against is using language that anthropomorphizes them to make them appear far more capable than they really are. That's dishonest at best, and only benefits companies and their shareholders.

Re: What happens when people don't understand how AI works

#46
post #18

I agree with the substance, but would argue the author fails to "understand how AI works" in an important way: LLMs are impressive probability gadgets that have been fed nearly the entire internet, and produce writing not by thinking but by making statistically informed guesses about which lexical item is likely to follow another Modern chat-tuned LLMs are not simply statistical models trained on web scale datasets.…

More accurately:

Modern chat-oriented LLMs are not simply statistical models trained on web scale datasets. Instead, they are the result of a two-stage process: first, large-scale pretraining on internet data, and then extensive fine-tuning through human feedback. Much of what makes these models feel responsive, safe, or emotionally intelligent is the outcome of thousands of hours of human annotation, often performed by outsourced data labelers around the world. The emotional skill and nuance attributed to these systems is, in large part, a reflection of the preferences and judgments of these human annotators, not merely the accumulation of web text.

So, when you interact with an advanced LLM, you’re not just engaging with a statistical model, nor are you simply seeing the unfiltered internet regurgitated back to you. Rather, you’re interacting with a system whose responses have been shaped and constrained by large-scale human feedback—sometimes from workers in places like Kenya—generalized through a neural network to handle any topic you bring up.

Re: What happens when people don't understand how AI works

#47
post #9

What really happens: "for some reason" higher up management thinks AI will let idiots run extremely complex companies. It doesn't. What AI actually does is like any other improved tool: it's a force multiplier. It allows a small number of highly experienced, very smart people, do double or triple the work they can do now. In other words: for idiot management, AI does nothing (EXCEPT enable the competition) Of course,…

> What AI actually does is like any other improved tool: it's a force multiplier. It allows a small number of highly experienced, very smart people, do double or triple the work they can do now.

It's different from other force-multiplier tools in that it cuts off the pipeline of new blood while simultaneously atrophying the experienced and smart people.

Re: What happens when people don't understand how AI works

#48

LLMs are divinatory instruments, our era's oracle, minus the incense and theatrics. If we were honest, we'd admit that "artificial intelligence" is just a modern gloss on a very old instinct: to consult a higher-order text generator and search for wisdom in the obscure. They tick all the boxes: oblique meaning, a semiotic field, the illusion of hidden knowledge, and a ritual interface. The only reason we don't call i…

>When we forget that, we get nonsense like "the chatbot told him he was the messiah," as though language could be blamed for the projection.

Words have power, and those that create words - or create machines that create words - have responsibility and liability.

It is not enough to say "the reader is responsible for meaning and their actions". When people or planet-burning random matrix multipliers say things and influence the thoughts and behaviors of others there is blame and there should be liability.

Those who spread lies that caused people to storm the Capitol on January 6th believing an election to be stolen are absolutely partially responsible even if they themselves did not go to DC on that day. Those who train machines that spit out lies which have driven people to racism and genocide in the past are responsible for the consequences.

Re: What happens when people don't understand how AI works

#49
post #33
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ya I don’t think I’ve seen any article going in depth into just how many low level humans like data labelers and RLHF’ers there are behind the scenes of these big models. It has to be millions of people worldwide.

I'm really curious to understand more about this. Right now there are top tier LLMs being produced by a bunch of different organizations: OpenAI and Anthropic and Google and Meta and DeepSeek and Qwen and Mistral and xAI and several others as well. Are they all employing separate armies of labelers? Are they ripping off each other's output to avoid that expense? Or is there some other, less labor intensive mechanisms…

There are middle-men companies like Scale that recruit thousands of remote contractors, probably through other companies they hire. There are of course other less known such companies that also sit between the model companies and the contracted labelers and RLHF’ers. There’s probably several tiers of these middle companies that agglomerate larger pools of workers. But how intermixed the work is and its scale I couldn’t tell you, nor if it’s shifting to something else.

I mean on LinkenIn you can find many AI trainer companies and see they hire for every subject, language, and programming language across several expertise levels. They provide the laborers for the model companies.

Re: What happens when people don't understand how AI works

#50

LLMs are divinatory instruments, our era's oracle, minus the incense and theatrics. If we were honest, we'd admit that "artificial intelligence" is just a modern gloss on a very old instinct: to consult a higher-order text generator and search for wisdom in the obscure. They tick all the boxes: oblique meaning, a semiotic field, the illusion of hidden knowledge, and a ritual interface. The only reason we don't call i…

This sounds very wise but doesn’t seem to describe any of my use cases. Maybe some use cases are divination but it is a stretch to call all of them that.

Just looking at my recent AI prompts:

I was looking for the name of the small fibers which form a bird’s feather. ChatGPT told me they are called “barbs”. Then using straight forward google search i could verify that indeed that is the name of the thing i was looking for. How is this “divination”?

I was looking for what is the g-code equivalent for galvo fiber lasers are and ChatGPT told me there isn’t really one. The closest might be the sdk of ezcad, but it also listed several other opensource control solutions too.

Wanted to know what are the hallmarking rules in the UK for an item which consist of multiple pieces of sterling silver held together by a non-metalic part. (Turns out the total weight of the silver matters, while the weight of the non-metalic part does not count.)

Wanted to translate the hungarian phrase “besurranó tolvaj” into english. Out of the many possible translations chatGPT provided “opportunistic burglar” fit the best for what I was looking for.

Wanted to write an sql alchemy model and i had an approximate idea of what fields i needed but couldn’t be arsed to come up with good names for them and find the syntax to describe their types. ChatGPT wrote it for me in seconds what would have taken me at least ten minutes otherwise.

These are “divination” only in a very galaxy brained “oh man, when you open your mind you see everything is divination really”. I would call most of these “information retrieval”. The information is out there the LLM just helps me find it with a convenient interface. While the last one is “coding”.

Post reply on HN