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Apple Notes Will Gain Markdown Export at WWDC, and, I Have Thoughts

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Re: Apple Notes Will Gain Markdown Export at WWDC, and, I Have Thoughts

#151
post #41

When Gruber mentions that he never uses Markdown outside of his blog, and hinting at the fact that it was not intended for text editors (and other apps), there's one important point I want to make. Yes, Markdown has disadvantages, and a few rough edges for uses as the format for editors et al, but there are two very big advantages and/or sideffects of it's widespread use: (1) it's cleartext and therefore very good as…

Agreed. For me, the popularity of Markdown on (pre-Microsoft) GitHub and GitLab was all I needed, to declare that the company wiki, code-embedded API docs, and anything else appropriate should just use Markdown.

Markdown is good enough for most of the documentation that software engineers do (other than diagrams), they already have to know it, and I don't want yet-another-markup-language to be a barrier to capturing and communicating institutional knowledge.

I also tell people that, if you're new to Markdown, even a plain text approximation that doesn't quite format correctly is strongly encouraged, so long as they capture the info somewhere accessible. I'll even offer to cheerfully fix the missing/bad Markdown, so that we have working docs and people can learn the very few parts of Markdown they missed; it's really not much.

(I personally have heavily used many much-much better technical documentation systems, and helped develop a WYSIWYG-ish SGML-based one professionally, but just using Markdown is a no-brainer right now. There are much more important things I want people learning and doing, than N different ways of minimally formatting documentation in N different places.)

Re: Apple Notes Will Gain Markdown Export at WWDC, and, I Have Thoughts

#153
post #41

When Gruber mentions that he never uses Markdown outside of his blog, and hinting at the fact that it was not intended for text editors (and other apps), there's one important point I want to make. Yes, Markdown has disadvantages, and a few rough edges for uses as the format for editors et al, but there are two very big advantages and/or sideffects of it's widespread use: (1) it's cleartext and therefore very good as…

Markdown is like the new WordPerfect for some people, who want expressive written paths to format text. Like with WordPerfect, there are people who get great utility (attorneys in WP, developers with Markdown), but 80-95% of people don’t get anything out of it. It’s also one of those things where the constraints are an advantage. Markdown is great for internet facing text content, while many aspects of the mainstream…

Former lawyer here. That most commercial contract work is done in Word is a source of major frustration and wasted time for many lawyers. Others are simply unaware that there are any authoring/editing paradigms that allow one to separate the drudgery of getting document formatting just-so, from the actual value-additive work.

Unfortunately there’s no realistic solution to the lock-in, so wrestling with broken paragraph formatting, mismatched text sizes, auto-numbering errors, etc at 2am before a client deadline remains the norm. One of the most frustrating parts of the job.

Re: Apple Notes Will Gain Markdown Export at WWDC, and, I Have Thoughts

#154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Attorneys and architects loved Word Perfect because it did line numbers better than any other software. Lawyer here: I loved WordPerfect (for DOS) because of Reveal Codes and its easy keystroke macros, which let me write an Emacs keyboard emulator for it. (Yes, I eventually did one for Microsoft Word for Windows, which I use to this day.)

That sounds really cool. Have you ever shared it?

I posted the DOS version on CompuServe (!) probably 30 or 35 years ago. I don't think I ever posted the Word for Windows version. I switched to a MacBook a dozen years ago; I think I remapped some of its keys to emulate Emacs. (But in recent years I've used mostly Emacs itself and org-mode, because these days I'm mostly a law professor and use Word mainly in the occasional client contract-negotiation project.)

Related: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10383691

Re: Apple Notes Will Gain Markdown Export at WWDC, and, I Have Thoughts

#155
post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those 80% sometimes DO get something out of it - when the resident nerd can fix their broken document because it’s Markdown or WordPerfect. Just because I can’t fix my car doesn’t mean I want an unfixable car.

Agreed, but that’s the tension. There’s no free lunch. On the flip, that user wants the complex features of the platform, and exposing them to a markup language takes elegant markdown and turns it into html or ooxml.

[flagged]

Re: Apple Notes Will Gain Markdown Export at WWDC, and, I Have Thoughts

#157
post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don’t want Notes to become a Markdown editor > I’m just asking for it to handle a few more things. How is what you're asking for not making Notes into a Markdown editor? Those are all features that come from Markdown, and the reason "most apps" already handle those, is because they're aiming to support Markdown to at least some extent.

I think the parent's suggesting that they should be "one way" shortcuts; i.e. "# Heading" auto-formatting as a heading is a shortcut, and it doesn't allow you to go back and modify the original markdown.

That's exactly it.

Re: Apple Notes Will Gain Markdown Export at WWDC, and, I Have Thoughts

#158
post #126

I don’t want Notes to become a Markdown editor. I think that would be confusing for the majority of users. What I would like is for it to understand Markdown syntax and just convert it to the right thing. If I type “# My Note”, it should convert that to note title format. If I type “## Heading” it should convert it to a heading format, and so on. Most apps do this already, to some extent. If you start a line with a -…

> I don’t want Notes to become a Markdown editor > I’m just asking for it to handle a few more things. How is what you're asking for not making Notes into a Markdown editor? Those are all features that come from Markdown, and the reason "most apps" already handle those, is because they're aiming to support Markdown to at least some extent.

MS Word is not aiming to support Markdown.

Re: Apple Notes Will Gain Markdown Export at WWDC, and, I Have Thoughts

#159
post #55

It makes sense that Markdown is a good tool for a specific purpose, and generalized note taking isn't it. As an aside, I have a dream that Apple Notes could be piped into a website as a form of blogging. As it is, I haven't found a way to do it...

I take my notes in INI format with a lose schema, as I accumulate data I tend to move towards something more concrete and write tools for it. I think this is the absolute best compromise between some kind of formal personal ERP-like (PRP?) system and something super loose like Markdown or org mode. Of course doing this on an iPhone is an absolute nightmare because everything has to be blessed by Apple and you can't j…

Did you ever test drive the Drafts app? It is remarkably easy to build customized workflows, both editing and document processing, and is built to be glue between different document/message apps.

Re: Apple Notes Will Gain Markdown Export at WWDC, and, I Have Thoughts

#160

It makes sense that Markdown is a good tool for a specific purpose, and generalized note taking isn't it. As an aside, I have a dream that Apple Notes could be piped into a website as a form of blogging. As it is, I haven't found a way to do it...

Also https://quotion.co/ for Notes to blog.
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