If you are useful, it doesn't mean you are valued • Hacker News Board

Re: If you are useful, it doesn't mean you are valued

#111

Post by light_hue_1 » Mon, Jun 02, 2025, 12:10 PM UTC

JadeNB wrote: post #99

0xEF wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've heard what you're describing phrase as follows: "If you want to know who truly values you, look for the people who would not be able to replace you with someone else." That usually has us pointing to friends and family, with the odd exception.

I'm not sure this is a reliable guide. I'm in academia, and the people who really can't be replaced are the administrative staff with hard-won institutional knowledge and connections--but they're valued far less than splashy big-name faculty with no institutional loyalty.

Yet the admin staff is the first to get fired and treated badly any time something changes.

While faculty basically no matter how useless can never be fired.

"can't be replaced" has two opposing meanings in your post.

Re: If you are useful, it doesn't mean you are valued

#112

Post by darkwater » Mon, Jun 02, 2025, 12:11 PM UTC

dinetrimr wrote: post #77

aaviator42 wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sorry to hear that, and hope you're able to figure out something sustainable soon. To other readers: don't quit your job until you have a new source of income locked in!

Thought I had one, turned in my notice but they rescinded offer a week later for no obvious reason and went hiring freeze. Was about the exact point when the market started inclining couple of years ago. Still think if I had interviewed a month before I would have got the position Been jobless ever since. I blame my self for it, for not having the insight. Consequences were severe

No, you should blame the company that rescinded the offer! Now it's probably too late but, did you try talking again with your former manager to see if you could get back your old job, after the offer was rescinded?

Re: If you are useful, it doesn't mean you are valued

#113

Post by whatnow37373 » Mon, Jun 02, 2025, 12:12 PM UTC

chii wrote: post #2

water is useful. Diamond is valued. So be the diamond, not the water. Unless there's no water around anymore...

So, basically, be super rare? And hard to work with?

Re: If you are useful, it doesn't mean you are valued

#114

Post by hn_throwaway_99 » Mon, Jun 02, 2025, 12:12 PM UTC

I feel like "useful" and "valued" are very poor terms for the situations described in the article. I think a much better explanation is that just because you may excel in one role (and be recognized as such) does not necessarily mean you'll excel in another role. And heck, I think it's important to recognize these qualities and limitations in yourself. Calling this being "useful" or "valued" puts an emotional/moral spin on this that is unwarranted in my opinion.

If anything, in a business relationship, I think it's important to recognize that nearly everyone is just "useful". It may be the case that people think you'll be more useful in an expanded role, and thus will give you advancement opportunities. But even then, the business environment may change, and your skills may not longer be highly prioritized. Just look at lots of the recent tech layoffs that have snared well-respected, senior technologists. Apparently they were "valued", until they weren't.

Re: If you are useful, it doesn't mean you are valued

#115

Post by jongjong » Mon, Jun 02, 2025, 12:14 PM UTC

What I hate about office politics is that it feels like all the planets have to align to get what you want. It's not reliable.

I'm way too clumsy and unpredictable for this 'one shot to make an impression' approach. During critical times, I tend to put forward my worst self, I can't help it. I tend to pathologically undersell myself and my work. Like my brain wants me to do everything on hard mode, just for entertainment value and so that I have stuff to talk/complain about. It's like I self-sabotage to ensure that my success rate stays below 10%.

When bad stuff happens, I don't even feel anything anymore. I expect failure. Though I still feel really great in those rare times when good stuff happens.

Re: If you are useful, it doesn't mean you are valued

#116

Post by agumonkey » Mon, Jun 02, 2025, 12:14 PM UTC

mboto wrote: post #62

What is also useful to keep in mind is the tendency to recreate your primary family life in the workplace. So if you had critical controlling parents who never valued you and everything you ever did was worthless, then you'll tend to select for those places and it is often done outside of awareness. Was your primary family spent being valued and appreciated? Then you'll select for that and when people start to not va…

The psychological basis is most probably one of the main forces.. your job is your survival, just like your parents were. Very often your refuse to challenge limit or keep boundaries because of the same fear of being ousted and out of options.

It's both very useful to get out of this pit, and also sad.. because our lives are not supposed to be fully transactional. We prefer to have a group with who we share more than notarial duties.

Re: If you are useful, it doesn't mean you are valued

#117

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Jun 02, 2025, 12:15 PM UTC

zwnow wrote: post #57

47282847 wrote: post #46

“ I distinguish four types. There are clever, hardworking, stupid, and lazy officers. Usually two characteristics are combined. Some are clever and hardworking; their place is the General Staff. The next ones are stupid and lazy; they make up 90 percent of every army and are suited to routine duties. Anyone who is both clever and lazy is qualified for the highest leadership duties, because he possesses the mental cla…

Guess I fit the stupid and lazy category, interesting thoughts though. I act like I work half of the day and the other half I procrastinate and work simultaneously. Part of it may be ADHD but somehow it works out for me... Still getting my work done.

[deleted]

Re: If you are useful, it doesn't mean you are valued

#118

Post by endemic » Mon, Jun 02, 2025, 12:16 PM UTC

apercu wrote: post #70

zwnow wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Guess I fit the stupid and lazy category, interesting thoughts though. I act like I work half of the day and the other half I procrastinate and work simultaneously. Part of it may be ADHD but somehow it works out for me... Still getting my work done.

That kind of work avoidance sounds like a lot of work. Advice would be to try to find a job or role doing something you’re interested it. A lot of the subject matter of my work is not that interesting to me, and the politics and lack of any sort of vision or leadership at most organizations these days makes project work sometimes stressful. But (maybe as a survival mechanism?) I’ve found that focusing on improving ho…

> Advice would be to try to find a job or role doing something you’re interested it.

Sounds great, where do I find it?

Re: If you are useful, it doesn't mean you are valued

#119

Post by agumonkey » Mon, Jun 02, 2025, 12:16 PM UTC

What surprises me, is that software engineering is not immune to that. I thought a domain where applied math and precision is normal would lead to a place where speed and quality would be praised, but human dynamics overshadow all of this and you end up swimming in politics just as in most jobs (some manual labour jobs are more easily quantifiable and high performers are praised though).

Re: If you are useful, it doesn't mean you are valued

#120

Post by whatnow37373 » Mon, Jun 02, 2025, 12:17 PM UTC

mindwok wrote: post #31

I'd say value, in the way the author defines it, is more a function of scarcity. If you are someone who can get stuff done but you are easily replaced, you are useful - not valuable. If you can get things done that nobody else can, or will, then you are valued.

In capitalism everything is a function of scarcity. I wonder how long we are going to keep up that particular charade.