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U.S. sanctions cloud provider 'Funnull' as top source of 'pig butchering' scams

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Re: U.S. sanctions cloud provider 'Funnull' as top source of 'pig butchering' scams

#61

Post by anovikov »

Waterluvian wrote: post #56
anovikov wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reason of most scams is the absurd level of trust existing in Western countries. When i first saw Upwork where hours were paid by the tracker in a guaranteed manner and people SIGNED for it, i knew West was doomed. I still find it hard to believe people can be that easy to dupe. Level of trust in the Western societies needs to be radically reduced through government propaganda, church and other channels. The world ha…

A high trust society is actually a good trait, not a bad one. It’s rather easy, lazy even, for a culture to devolve into a low trust minima. That’s basically the default state that people have endeavoured to evolve out of. I think it’s also the kind of thing that can easily overwhelm anxious minds. The kind where “what if it’s a scam?” leads them to never taking a risk, donating to a cause, doing someone a favour. No…

[flagged]

Re: U.S. sanctions cloud provider 'Funnull' as top source of 'pig butchering' scams

#62

Post by homebrewer »

anovikov wrote: post #52
naet wrote: post #25

Cryptocurrency enables a big part of this. Not saying that there weren't any wire scams before crypto, but crypto has made it much easier for average people to make anonymous international money transfers that can't be reversed. Not to start a big argument, but to my eyes the main usecases of cryptocurrency are to bet on them as a speculative asset or to use them for various forms of crime. Someone will probably tell…

Reason of most scams is the absurd level of trust existing in Western countries. When i first saw Upwork where hours were paid by the tracker in a guaranteed manner and people SIGNED for it, i knew West was doomed. I still find it hard to believe people can be that easy to dupe. Level of trust in the Western societies needs to be radically reduced through government propaganda, church and other channels. The world ha…

There's little societal trust in e.g. Russia, and yet they're getting massively scammed by Ukrainian call centers every day. People selling their only housing, sending all their savings for “safekeeping” overseas, are daily news. Not just old ladies (but them too), but also middle-aged intellectuals who were supposed to know better.

It's all using the same schemes that have been explained in the news over and over again, there's little innovation on that front. You have to be living under a rock the for past few years to fall for them, and yet people do. I think there's simply a certain amount of marks in every society, regardless of how its members trust each other, and the only reliable way of protecting them is managing everybody's lives DPRK-style.

Re: U.S. sanctions cloud provider 'Funnull' as top source of 'pig butchering' scams

#63

Post by silisili »

kalaksi wrote: post #58
naet wrote: post #25

Cryptocurrency enables a big part of this. Not saying that there weren't any wire scams before crypto, but crypto has made it much easier for average people to make anonymous international money transfers that can't be reversed. Not to start a big argument, but to my eyes the main usecases of cryptocurrency are to bet on them as a speculative asset or to use them for various forms of crime. Someone will probably tell…

The banks here have said that if you get scammed and money has been transferred (no cryptocurrency involved), there's nothing they can do. It was a bit surprising to hear since you only hear cryptocurrency transactions being irreversible.

Banks aren't perfect, but they also aren't anonymous.

If you feel wronged, you can take appropriate legal recourse.

Crypto offers no such thing.

Re: U.S. sanctions cloud provider 'Funnull' as top source of 'pig butchering' scams

#64

Post by ksenzee »

anovikov wrote: post #61
Waterluvian wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A high trust society is actually a good trait, not a bad one. It’s rather easy, lazy even, for a culture to devolve into a low trust minima. That’s basically the default state that people have endeavoured to evolve out of. I think it’s also the kind of thing that can easily overwhelm anxious minds. The kind where “what if it’s a scam?” leads them to never taking a risk, donating to a cause, doing someone a favour. No…

[flagged]

Sorry, are you saying that the main reason immigrants from Eastern Europe and India become rich is through scamming hapless fools? Not through, say, hard work and educational opportunities? And are you saying this is a change, or how it’s always been?

Re: U.S. sanctions cloud provider 'Funnull' as top source of 'pig butchering' scams

#65

Post by anovikov »

homebrewer wrote: post #62
anovikov wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reason of most scams is the absurd level of trust existing in Western countries. When i first saw Upwork where hours were paid by the tracker in a guaranteed manner and people SIGNED for it, i knew West was doomed. I still find it hard to believe people can be that easy to dupe. Level of trust in the Western societies needs to be radically reduced through government propaganda, church and other channels. The world ha…

There's little societal trust in e.g. Russia, and yet they're getting massively scammed by Ukrainian call centers every day. People selling their only housing, sending all their savings for “safekeeping” overseas, are daily news. Not just old ladies (but them too), but also middle-aged intellectuals who were supposed to know better. It's all using the same schemes that have been explained in the news over and over ag…

I think the only reason of why it works is that Ukrainians are an even lower trust culture, and they are better and more cynical at duping people. Plus, in Ukraine many people see it as their patriotic duty, and perhaps rightfully so, so these kind of jobs are likely to attract quite sophisticated people who will be able to pull off very believable scams, not some social rejects or worse, forced labor sitting in Myanmar jungle, as it is in Asia vs USA scams.

Re: U.S. sanctions cloud provider 'Funnull' as top source of 'pig butchering' scams

#66

Post by ksenzee »

duskwuff wrote: post #8
robcohen wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

KindHearts for Charitable Humanitarian Development v. Geithner and Al Haramain Islamic Foundation v. U.S. Department of the Treasury

Those are names of cases, not laws.

Perhaps you’re not familiar with the common law system and its reliance on case law?

Re: U.S. sanctions cloud provider 'Funnull' as top source of 'pig butchering' scams

#67

Post by whatsupdog »

silisili wrote: post #63
kalaksi wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The banks here have said that if you get scammed and money has been transferred (no cryptocurrency involved), there's nothing they can do. It was a bit surprising to hear since you only hear cryptocurrency transactions being irreversible.

Banks aren't perfect, but they also aren't anonymous. If you feel wronged, you can take appropriate legal recourse. Crypto offers no such thing.

Good luck taking legal action against an off shore entity, especially when the legal fees is more than the money transferred, and the money most likely moved to three different accounts in as many countries from that first off shore account.

Re: U.S. sanctions cloud provider 'Funnull' as top source of 'pig butchering' scams

#68

Post by aziaziazi »

anovikov wrote: post #52
naet wrote: post #25

Cryptocurrency enables a big part of this. Not saying that there weren't any wire scams before crypto, but crypto has made it much easier for average people to make anonymous international money transfers that can't be reversed. Not to start a big argument, but to my eyes the main usecases of cryptocurrency are to bet on them as a speculative asset or to use them for various forms of crime. Someone will probably tell…

Reason of most scams is the absurd level of trust existing in Western countries. When i first saw Upwork where hours were paid by the tracker in a guaranteed manner and people SIGNED for it, i knew West was doomed. I still find it hard to believe people can be that easy to dupe. Level of trust in the Western societies needs to be radically reduced through government propaganda, church and other channels. The world ha…

The cost world you describe didn’t emerge because of fear of god (which has been prevalent for milleniums, mostly everywhere) but the abondance of cheap energy and goods, basically since oil starts getting processed but other minor factors helped too. Democracy and peace emerges when peoples aren’t scared to miss food anymore.

Re: U.S. sanctions cloud provider 'Funnull' as top source of 'pig butchering' scams

#69

Post by anovikov »

ksenzee wrote: post #64
anovikov wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Sorry, are you saying that the main reason immigrants from Eastern Europe and India become rich is through scamming hapless fools? Not through, say, hard work and educational opportunities? And are you saying this is a change, or how it’s always been?

[flagged]
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