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How to Get a Job as a Developer in Less Than Six Months

learnwithjeff.com

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Re: How to Get a Job as a Developer in Less Than Six Months

#121

Post by tgrass »

jasonkester wrote: post #111
tgrass wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Next time you cross a bridge, realize civil engineering has the same issue.

No, it doesn't. Before you can design a bridge, you have to graduate with a four year degree in Civil Engineering. Then you have to pass the Engineer In Training (EIT) exam, then work for four years in the industry (helping with, but never actually able to sign off on, designs), then pass the Professional Engineer (PE) exam specific to the discipline you now have 4 years experience with. Then you get to design your f…

Are you on the ethics review board? Or can one speak frankly here about engineering?

You do not need a degree to be an EIT. You do not need to have studied engineering to be a PE. The CAD tech who assists in design (to the review board:"so I've been told by our competing firms") does not even need a high school diploma.

The PE who seals the plan is human. He had four projects going, they all have deadlines, and he trusts his staff to get it right. He checks as much as he can, but he doesn't have the time or the skill to check everything. He often cannot even check his own assumptions on many calculations because half his focus and career development is on project management and business development. It has not been on double checking the basis of the formulas his software has implemented.

Re: How to Get a Job as a Developer in Less Than Six Months

#122

Post by fjellfras »

slurgfest wrote: post #104
textminer wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're from more of a math background (with maybe a little MATLAB knowledge). Python's a great language for machine learning and natural language processing tasks. Great glue language, lots of libraries, prototype quickly, scale with multiprocessing or Hadoop streaming or pycloud. Build your own analysis stack or classifier then display the results on the web with Bottle or Flask.

These are true statements about Python's strengths. I don't realistically see how those are going to help you get a job unless that job also takes an advanced degree, or at the very least a BS touching on a field you have specialized knowledge of.

I've been stuck in this exact same place for the last one year or so. I wanted a job in machine learning or possibly NLP and python is my language of choice, while the language is an excellent tool for these tasks I have not been able to find jobs in ML or NLP possibly because both of these fields involve quite a bit more than the programming related work.

To top this off I live in India and it has been difficult to find quality jobs here; the ones that will hire a less experienced person like me, of course :-)

Re: How to Get a Job as a Developer in Less Than Six Months

#124

Post by kmfrk »

Can anyone outside the U.S. - preferably in Europe - share similar stories, if any?

I find that the U.S. has so many cool ways to work your way into a programming gig, it makes anyone outside red with envy, but I struggle to find something similar in Europe - especially in smaller countries.

What would your advice be for us who can't get a U.S. visa?

EDIT: I'm thinking mainly of Python/Django jobs and communities here.

Re: How to Get a Job as a Developer in Less Than Six Months

#125

Post by Nathandim »

borplk wrote: post #120
technotony wrote: post #30

It's really frustrating reading all the negative comments here. What happened to positive support for people in our community? This guy had a passion, worked his butt off and got a good result... I'm sure he'll go on to many more good things in the future. We should applaud and celebrate this, not knock down how he's not a senior developer yet. Congratulations Jeff!!

It is great to see these posts and I absolutely applaud him for what he has achieved. Programming, like any other profession takes time to master, how would you react to "How to become a brain surgeon in less than 6 months"? If you were to have a brain surgery would you choose the guy who was unemployed 6 months ago, or the other one who has been performing these surgeries for the last 20 years, every day? My point,…

It's perfectly fine for a company to ask for a developer with more years of experience. However, the post mentions a junior developer position, which means they do not expect him to know things that developers with 20+ years experience (according to your surgeon example) do.

Re: How to Get a Job as a Developer in Less Than Six Months

#126

Post by dagw »

kmfrk wrote: post #124

Can anyone outside the U.S. - preferably in Europe - share similar stories, if any? I find that the U.S. has so many cool ways to work your way into a programming gig, it makes anyone outside red with envy, but I struggle to find something similar in Europe - especially in smaller countries. What would your advice be for us who can't get a U.S. visa? EDIT: I'm thinking mainly of Python/Django jobs and communities her…

The big advantage with the US in this case is that it is often cheap and easy to fire someone. This makes companies much more likely to take a chance on someone, since they know they can get quickly rid of them if it doesn't work out.

Re: How to Get a Job as a Developer in Less Than Six Months

#127

Post by tgrass »

lightcatcher wrote: post #67
tgrass wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Next time you cross a bridge, realize civil engineering has the same issue.

Is this a metaphorical point, or do you actually have knowledge of the civil engineering job market? I wouldn't think that civil engineering would find itself in a similar place as the software industry, because civil engineering work seems like it would be more constant over time and less susceptible to bubbles. This would mean the demand for new civil engineers would be relatively time constant. However, I know not…

I was not replying to the point about lowering the bar due to market demand. Though, now that I think about it, if you were a very bright engineer, would you go into a lackluster career in civil that would start out at $45k and only find small increases in salary now that there is little demand for housing, or would you go into software? So clearly there is going to be brain drain. But I was not referring to market economics. See my point above (http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4412278).

I will say that my point did not suggest "horror" - as in horrifying you. Leaking sensitive user data is not, in my opinion, on par with a bridge completely structurally failing while traffic is on it. Unless of course the web app is for a bank. Which is the sort of security work that likely does not have the coffee fetching intern designing its protocols. But even then, I think as a society we are clearly willing to have many more cases of ID theft than deaths from bridge failure.

The comparison should be equal: are there bridges that require maintenance more often than is reasonable? Is their lifespan long enough? Are their piers sunk deeply enough to accommodate the scour of the river (we have several bridges here locally that are under restoration efforts because the scour was not adequately considered)? Was the water surface elevation of the design storm of the river accurately predicted to which the answer is realistically always no; there is no such thing as accuracy in backwater analysis - for before one even begins to model the river, one has to assume how MUCH water it could have - and that can vary widely, being a combination of not-always-comprehensive statistical analysis of historical precipitation, stream gauge data, and semi-empirical algorithms - stress on the semi.

Now, see my above comment about how civil plans actually get out the door, and I would say this is not a metaphor. We know from experience that if a "hot new startup" or even a stodgy old site (linkedIn, eHarmony, Last.FM) loses user data, it is not the end of the world, let alone the end of the startup. If a bridge fails and falls, the PE loses his licence. If the bridge fails and requires extra maintenance, the county and the firm lawyer up and the JDs make a lot of money in court.

Re: How to Get a Job as a Developer in Less Than Six Months

#128

Post by imgabe »

tgrass wrote: post #121
jasonkester wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it doesn't. Before you can design a bridge, you have to graduate with a four year degree in Civil Engineering. Then you have to pass the Engineer In Training (EIT) exam, then work for four years in the industry (helping with, but never actually able to sign off on, designs), then pass the Professional Engineer (PE) exam specific to the discipline you now have 4 years experience with. Then you get to design your f…

Are you on the ethics review board? Or can one speak frankly here about engineering? You do not need a degree to be an EIT. You do not need to have studied engineering to be a PE. The CAD tech who assists in design (to the review board:"so I've been told by our competing firms") does not even need a high school diploma. The PE who seals the plan is human. He had four projects going, they all have deadlines, and he tr…

If you're going for an EIT without a degree, you're required to have 20 years of experience (in my state at least). Any decent engineering firm is going to have a quality control process in place to ensure that someone reviews drawings before they're stamped and signed (maybe not necessarily the person stamping and signing them).

Yes, there is a level of trust involved, but "I had four other projects going" is not going to be an acceptable excuse if a bridge collapses.

Re: How to Get a Job as a Developer in Less Than Six Months

#129

Post by santa_boy »

the_cat_kittles wrote: post #4

You really did a great job! I took longer than you, but I followed a similar path. In hindsight, I can't imagine taking any other path, its been a blast! If I could emphasize one of your points, it would be to MAKE stuff, don't pick out problems out of thin air, MAKE stuff you want! I really happy for you, and I'm really glad you wrote this. I haven't agreed with someone so much in a while! Also, I would reinforce yo…

I would also reinforce the github point. It is as important a point especially when you are working on a start-up idea alongside a regular day-job.

Git pushes really give an indication the progress, skills, "actual work" and ideas to re-prioritize or launch.

Sorry if it sounds obvious but I really feel in a resource crunched situation the best one can do is to push out as much as possible to git and take them further to push to the real world to get some real feedback!

Back to the topic .... if the start-up doesn't stick on ... surely it can get a great job with a great employee!

Re: How to Get a Job as a Developer in Less Than Six Months

#130

Post by tgrass »

imgabe wrote: post #128
tgrass wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you on the ethics review board? Or can one speak frankly here about engineering? You do not need a degree to be an EIT. You do not need to have studied engineering to be a PE. The CAD tech who assists in design (to the review board:"so I've been told by our competing firms") does not even need a high school diploma. The PE who seals the plan is human. He had four projects going, they all have deadlines, and he tr…

If you're going for an EIT without a degree, you're required to have 20 years of experience (in my state at least). Any decent engineering firm is going to have a quality control process in place to ensure that someone reviews drawings before they're stamped and signed (maybe not necessarily the person stamping and signing them). Yes, there is a level of trust involved, but "I had four other projects going" is not go…

see comment below: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4412403

Additionally: In AZ one can test for the EIT without a degree after four years of work experience (thus, you can start at 18, work instead of school, and still be at the same point as a college grad at 22: an EIT).

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