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Deepseek R1-0528

huggingface.co

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Re: Deepseek R1-0528

#101

Post by make3 »

jazzyjackson wrote: post #75
jacob019 wrote: post #68

Well that didn't take long, available from 7 providers through openrouter. https://openrouter.ai/deepseek/deepseek-r1-0528/providers May 28th update to the original DeepSeek R1 Performance on par with OpenAI o1, but open-sourced and with fully open reasoning tokens. It's 671B parameters in size, with 37B active in an inference pass. Fully open-source model.

No sign of what source material it was trained on though right? So open weight rather than reproducible from source. I remember there's a project "Open R1" that last I checked was working on gathering their own list of training material, looks active but not sure how far along they've gotten: https://github.com/huggingface/open-r1

I don't think people make the distinction like that. The open source vs non open source distinction boils down to, usually, can you use it for commercial use.

what you're saying is just that it's non reproducible, which is a completely valid but separate issue

Re: Deepseek R1-0528

#102

Post by piperswe »

make3 wrote: post #101
jazzyjackson wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No sign of what source material it was trained on though right? So open weight rather than reproducible from source. I remember there's a project "Open R1" that last I checked was working on gathering their own list of training material, looks active but not sure how far along they've gotten: https://github.com/huggingface/open-r1

I don't think people make the distinction like that. The open source vs non open source distinction boils down to, usually, can you use it for commercial use. what you're saying is just that it's non reproducible, which is a completely valid but separate issue

But where's the source? I just see a binary blob, what makes it open source?

Re: Deepseek R1-0528

#103

Post by therein »

willchen wrote: post #4

I love how Deepseek just casually drops new updates (that deliver big improvements) without fanfare.

Much more preferred to what OpenAI always did and Anthropic recently started doing. Just write some complicated narrative about how scary this new model is and how it tried to escape and deceive and hack the mainframe while telling the alignment operators bed time stories.

Re: Deepseek R1-0528

#104

Post by echelon »

fragmede wrote: post #77
jacob019 wrote: post #68

Well that didn't take long, available from 7 providers through openrouter. https://openrouter.ai/deepseek/deepseek-r1-0528/providers May 28th update to the original DeepSeek R1 Performance on par with OpenAI o1, but open-sourced and with fully open reasoning tokens. It's 671B parameters in size, with 37B active in an inference pass. Fully open-source model.

It's. not. open. source! https://www.downloadableisnotopensource.org/

Open source is a crazy new beast in the AI/ML world.

We have numerous artifacts to reason about:

- The model code

- The training code

- The fine tuning code

- The inference code

- The raw training data

- The processed training data (which might vary across various stages of pre-training and potentially fine-tuning!)

- The resultant weights

- The inference outputs (which also need a license)

- The research papers (hopefully it's described in literature!)

- The patents (or lack thereof)

The term "open source" is wholly inadequate here. We need a 10-star grading system for this.

This is not your mamma's C library.

AFAICT, DeepSeek scores 7/10, which is better than OpenAI's 0/10 (they don't even let you train on the outputs).

This is more than enough to distill new models from.

Everybody is laundering training data, and it's rife with copyrighted data, PII, and pilfered outputs from other commercial AI systems. Because of that, I don't expect we'll see much legally open training data for some time to come. In fact, the first fully open training data of adequate size (not something like LJSpeech) is likely to be 100% synthetic or robotically-captured.

Re: Deepseek R1-0528

#105

Post by fragmede »

numpad0 wrote: post #99
behnamoh wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's got more 'source' than whatever OpenAI provides for their models.

less alcoholic beverages are fully alcoholic beverages

but they're not bleach, and no amount of adding or removing alcohol can transmute the alcohol into something else.

Re: Deepseek R1-0528

#106

Post by danielhanchen »

behnamoh wrote: post #85
danielhanchen wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We made DeepSeek R1 run on a local device via offloading and 1.58bit quantization :) https://unsloth.ai/blog/deepseekr1-dynamic I'm working on the new one!

> 1.58bit quantization of course we can run any model if quantize it enough. but I think the OP was talking about the unquantized version.

Oh you can still run them unquantized! See https://docs.unsloth.ai/basics/llama-4-how-to-run-and-fine-t... where we show you can offload all MoE layers to system RAM, and leave non MoE layers on the GPU - the speed is still pretty good!

You can do it via `-ot ".ffn_.*_exps.=CPU"`

Re: Deepseek R1-0528

#107

Post by danielhanchen »

nxobject wrote: post #83
CamperBob2 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your 1.58-bit dynamic quant model is a religious experience, even at one or two tokens per second (which is what I get on my 128 MB Raptor Lake+4090). It's like owning your own genie... just ridiculously smart. Thanks for the work you've put into it!

Likewise - for me, it feels how I imagined getting a microcomputer in the 70s was like. (Including the hit to the wallet… an Apple II cost the 2024 equivalent of ~$5k, too.)

:) The good ol days!

Re: Deepseek R1-0528

#109

Post by lexandstuff »

doctoboggan wrote: post #27
Maxatar wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does releasing it today affect the market compared to releasing it last week?

Hard to say exactly how it will affect the market, but IIRC when deepseek was first released Nvidia stock took a big hit as people realized that you could develop high performing LLMs without access to Nvidia hardware.

Except that, all Deepseek models so far have been trained on Nvidia hardware. For Deepseek v3, they literally mention that they used 2,048 NVIDIA H800 GPUs right in the abstract: https://arxiv.org/html/2505.09343v1

Re: Deepseek R1-0528

#110

Post by janalsncm »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #64
wyre wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From what I understand, isn’t DeepSeek just a pet project from a Chinese hedge fund? They have much less reason to create a buzz compared to openAI, Anthropic, or Google.

None of those players you mention actually need to create a buzz. People will do it for them for free. DeepSeek joined this group after releasing R1. Despite constant protestations of hype among the tech crowd, GenAI really is big enough of a deal that new developments don't need to be pushed onto market; people are voluntarily seeking them out.

Well OpenAI is constantly asking for and raising money. If “buzz” isn’t the right word maybe mystique? Because “race to the bottom in a hyper-commoditized space” probably doesn’t get you billions. No, Sam Altman wants people to believe they are very close to AGI and a TAM of global GDP.
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