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We consistently underestimate kids.

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Re: We consistently underestimate kids.

#51

Post by csense »

firefoxman1 wrote: post #29

In 3rd grade I built a transistor radio for the science fair. I remember being so proud that I built it, but my mom seemed to be way more proud of that meaningless blue ribbon. That's the problem, I think. It seems too many parents encourage artificial achievement that can be quantified, like grades or ribbons, which keeps kids from truly exploring what they are capable of doing.

This type of encouragement results in bright kids becoming good at doing things because they please parents / teachers / professors / bosses.

Whereas our best and brightest should be encouraged to work out things for themselves, push boundaries, and in general, innovate.

Kudos for finding someone that could understand and appreciate what you were capable of, though. Not all kids have that; as a kid it can be very discouraging when you don't have anyone who understands your work to talk to.

Re: We consistently underestimate kids.

#52

Post by csense »

balinvadasz wrote: post #37

Parent of a 4 and 1 year old here. Kids can be surprisingly smart and "dumb" at the same time. Their rote intelligence can shine if problems are presented in ways they can easily comprehend them but even simple emotional intelligence tasks ("if I kick my sister it hurts her the same amount as it hurts me when I get kicked") stump them. This confuses adults (myself included) and sometimes makes us expect more from the…

> even simple emotional intelligence tasks ("if I kick my sister it hurts her the same amount as it hurts me when I get kicked") stump them

Thinking back to when I was a kid, this one probably boils down to the "interrupt" aspect of behavior modification. It doesn't matter if the kid intellectually understands the Golden Rule if it doesn't cross his mind in between the time he thinks about kicking his sister and when he actually does it.

I would say it's punishment that remedies this -- you can think about punishment like registering a hardware interrupt that will cause negative emotions to spontaneously activate when the same situation arises in the future.

This is complementary to the child's intellectual understanding of why it's wrong to hit his sister.

Understanding without punishment makes ethics a purely academic exercise rather than something that should be practiced in daily life. Punishment without understanding breeds resentment and/or strange, dysfunctional worldviews.

Disclaimer: I've never had kids, nor have I been closely involved in the raising of younger family members, nor am I an expert in this area. Much depends on the particular individual kids, parents and circumstances. YMMV.

Re: We consistently underestimate kids.

#53

Post by csense »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #13
dandrews wrote: post #11

26 years ago I wrote a BAT file ("kristen") for the household MS-DOS computer, which would play Christmas carols whenever my two-year-old daughter typed her name on the keyboard and pressed the return key. She learned quickly to switch the system on, wait for the boot sequence to complete, and play music All By Herself. It was a revelation: kids as young as that don't have eye-hand coordination enough to scribble rec…

Same story - 4yr old could type and mouse before he could write. His handwriting is still crap :)

As a kid, I never saw the point in learning handwriting because the computer could do it so much faster and better.

Today's kids are going to be so different compared to anyone who comes before, they'll be asking "why learn anything when we have Google, Bing, and Wolfram Alpha?"

Re: We consistently underestimate kids.

#54

Post by csense »

Peroni wrote: post #14
lifeisstillgood wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you - I am going to buy a cheap laptop (maybe two to stop fighting) for each child. Question: What should go on there? Or should I go for the iPad and push the "educational" games

Kids tend to take to tablets brilliantly in my experience. My son turned two a couple of months ago and he can unlock my iPad, swipe across to the next page, select his folder containing his apps (mostly educational, one or two fun apps) choose an app, play with it for a bit, close the app and open a new one. He recently learned how to work the camera which is pretty awesome. Interesting side effect: He now thinks al…

I remember playing video games with a younger family member before he could read. (I want to say the system in question was a Sega Saturn, but I'm not one hundred percent sure about this.) He didn't know what the menus said, but he knew exactly which options he wanted and how to move through several menu screens.

I was impressed.

Moral of the story: A halfway decent interactive interface can work wonders for a kid's ability to unleash his mind.

Re: We consistently underestimate kids.

#55

Post by pjscott »

bluedanieru wrote: post #10
colomon wrote: post #2

While I fully agree that we underestimate kids, I've got to say that my three-year-old spent a gleeful half hour riding up and down escalators back in March, and was sad when we said he had to stop. Little kids can be surprisingly smart and still be amused by simple, repetitive things that would bore adults out of their skulls.

Pretty much all I've ever wanted to do is walk down an up escalator (and vice versa) at just the right pace that I don't move. Then run a bit faster, slow down a bit, etc. All my earthly ambitions boil down to this.

I wanted to do this, so I found an escalator with nobody else on it, and played around. It was great. Reach out and seize your dreams!

Re: We consistently underestimate kids.

#56

Post by bobbles »

squonk wrote: post #16
anu_gupta wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still get a small thrill from stepping onto a particularly long escalator (eg the one at Angel tube station in London, which is the 3rd biggest in Western Europe), but then again, my partner often says I'm essentially a five year old trapped in an adult's body.

There is an awesome one at Tokyo Station (Chuo line?) Up about two stories, then horizontal for 10 meters, then up another two stories. Ya, I could spend hours on that one....

North Ryde station in Sydney has a really open area around the escalators which is quite creepy for people afraid of heights:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:North_Ryde_station_escalat...

Re: We consistently underestimate kids.

#57

Post by lostlogin »

bluedanieru wrote: post #10
colomon wrote: post #2

While I fully agree that we underestimate kids, I've got to say that my three-year-old spent a gleeful half hour riding up and down escalators back in March, and was sad when we said he had to stop. Little kids can be surprisingly smart and still be amused by simple, repetitive things that would bore adults out of their skulls.

Pretty much all I've ever wanted to do is walk down an up escalator (and vice versa) at just the right pace that I don't move. Then run a bit faster, slow down a bit, etc. All my earthly ambitions boil down to this.

Travelators (is that what they are called?) in airports always get me going. Walking the wrong way on themmoon strangely fun. Moon walking for the guy who can't dance.

Re: We consistently underestimate kids.

#58

Post by lostlogin »

csense wrote: post #52
balinvadasz wrote: post #37

Parent of a 4 and 1 year old here. Kids can be surprisingly smart and "dumb" at the same time. Their rote intelligence can shine if problems are presented in ways they can easily comprehend them but even simple emotional intelligence tasks ("if I kick my sister it hurts her the same amount as it hurts me when I get kicked") stump them. This confuses adults (myself included) and sometimes makes us expect more from the…

> even simple emotional intelligence tasks ("if I kick my sister it hurts her the same amount as it hurts me when I get kicked") stump them Thinking back to when I was a kid, this one probably boils down to the "interrupt" aspect of behavior modification. It doesn't matter if the kid intellectually understands the Golden Rule if it doesn't cross his mind in between the time he thinks about kicking his sister and when…

I want to understand the down votes.. As a parent of one young child, I find discipline the hardest aspect of being a parent. Holy hell it twists me in knots trying to work out when to draw the line, when to ignore and when to warn. Luckily my wife is better at this.

Re: We consistently underestimate kids.

#59

Post by DeepDuh »

csense wrote: post #53
JoeAltmaier wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same story - 4yr old could type and mouse before he could write. His handwriting is still crap :)

As a kid, I never saw the point in learning handwriting because the computer could do it so much faster and better. Today's kids are going to be so different compared to anyone who comes before, they'll be asking "why learn anything when we have Google, Bing, and Wolfram Alpha?"

Giving computers to young children is one thing. I would think twice about giving them unrestricted internet however. I kinda like the lego raspberry computer idea combined with the 'showing CLI first' idea someone had here (obviously not for children below the age of 7 or so).

Re: We consistently underestimate kids.

#60

Post by JacksonGariety »

lifeisstillgood wrote: post #12
dandrews wrote: post #11

26 years ago I wrote a BAT file ("kristen") for the household MS-DOS computer, which would play Christmas carols whenever my two-year-old daughter typed her name on the keyboard and pressed the return key. She learned quickly to switch the system on, wait for the boot sequence to complete, and play music All By Herself. It was a revelation: kids as young as that don't have eye-hand coordination enough to scribble rec…

Thank you - I am going to buy a cheap laptop (maybe two to stop fighting) for each child. Question: What should go on there? Or should I go for the iPad and push the "educational" games

The tablet interface is way more natural than the computer. If you're got the cash, go for the iPad. If not, I might even recommend one of the 7" Nexus tables Google puts out. I'm no Android guy, but that is a great product for its price.
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