https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alasdair_MacIntyre https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/After_Virtue
[deleted]
Remembering Alasdair MacIntyre
21–30 of 78 posts
Re: Remembering Alasdair MacIntyre
#22Now I want to know whose work McIntyre described as "the philosophical equivalent of Vogue ".
Richard Rorty, whose humanism and love of democracy MacIntyre despised. Over the course of his career, MacIntyre went from an extreme left Marxist to an extreme right Thomist, and the only constant was his hatred of liberalism. He really couldn't stand the idea that people could believe in rationalism, feel the moral force of individual rights, or make purpose and meaning for themselves, all without appealing to an a…
> […] all without appealing to an authoritarian source of control.
Well that was partly what After Virtue was about: arguing it wasn't possible to have an objective moral system without the supernatural.
* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/After_Virtue
And he's not the only one to hold this view (many atheists do as well):
* https://global.oup.com/academic/product/atheist-overreach-97...
You're left with either Nietzsche's arbitrary will, or virtues (à la Aristotle). For the latter, MacIntyre attempted to develop a system of morality (? ethics?) based on human biology:
* https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/655623.Dependent_Rationa...
Once can certainly tell oneself that there is a certain purpose or meaning to one's life, but if you're a materialist, then (the argument goes (AIUI)) it's not true.
* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Is–ought_problem
The arrangement of atoms is arbitrary and without meaning, and to call some arrangement(s) "good" or "bad" or better / worse is a value judgement that is just as arbitrary and meaningless.
Re: Remembering Alasdair MacIntyre
#23After Virtue was one of my favorite books, and it helped me get started learning about the history of ideas. I knew he was getting older, but I'm saddened to see him pass. In college, I had hoped that I could meet him one day. Rest in peace.
Re: Remembering Alasdair MacIntyre
#24Now I want to know whose work McIntyre described as "the philosophical equivalent of Vogue ".
Richard Rorty, whose humanism and love of democracy MacIntyre despised. Over the course of his career, MacIntyre went from an extreme left Marxist to an extreme right Thomist, and the only constant was his hatred of liberalism. He really couldn't stand the idea that people could believe in rationalism, feel the moral force of individual rights, or make purpose and meaning for themselves, all without appealing to an a…
Perhaps, but 20 years after Rorty's death, he's largely forgotten. I think it unlikely the same will be true of MacIntyre two-decades hence.
Re: Remembering Alasdair MacIntyre
#25I recommend some of his other works: Whose Justice, Whose Rationality and Dependent Rational Animals.
It’s rewarding to seem him attempt a reconciliation between some modern epistemologies and Augustinian Thomism. I’m not sure he really pulls it off but his stature as a thinker in moral philosophy is undeniable.
Re: Remembering Alasdair MacIntyre
#26“After Virtue” annoys me because it basically argues that morality only makes sense within cultural traditions, as if we’re all just trapped in our local narratives with no access to universal truths. MacIntyre romanticizes ancient communities and traditions, but ignores the fact that plenty of those upheld horrifying practices—like slavery, misogyny, or human sacrifice—and calling those ‘virtuous’ just because they fit a narrative feels like moral relativism in disguise.
I get that modern ethics can feel fragmented, but the answer isn’t to retreat into tribalism or pretend reason can’t give us shared values across cultures.
Just because some people are bad at finding moral clarity doesn’t mean it’s impossible or meaningless.
Re: Remembering Alasdair MacIntyre
#27Now I want to know whose work McIntyre described as "the philosophical equivalent of Vogue ".
Richard Rorty, whose humanism and love of democracy MacIntyre despised. Over the course of his career, MacIntyre went from an extreme left Marxist to an extreme right Thomist, and the only constant was his hatred of liberalism. He really couldn't stand the idea that people could believe in rationalism, feel the moral force of individual rights, or make purpose and meaning for themselves, all without appealing to an a…
He didn’t write as if he hated liberalism. Maybe he did. But in his work you get deep, principled critique from the basis of epistemology and selfhood.
Lenin wrote like someone who hates liberalism. Stephen Miller gives that vibe from the right, though I doubt he can write anything coherent at all.
Re: Remembering Alasdair MacIntyre
#28“After Virtue” annoys me because it basically argues that morality only makes sense within cultural traditions, as if we’re all just trapped in our local narratives with no access to universal truths. MacIntyre romanticizes ancient communities and traditions, but ignores the fact that plenty of those upheld horrifying practices—like slavery, misogyny, or human sacrifice—and calling those ‘virtuous’ just because they…
How can reason give us shared values across cultures? Why do you suppose your moral clarity was generated from your brain and not your gut?
Re: Remembering Alasdair MacIntyre
#29Now I want to know whose work McIntyre described as "the philosophical equivalent of Vogue ".
[deleted]
Re: Remembering Alasdair MacIntyre
#30“After Virtue” annoys me because it basically argues that morality only makes sense within cultural traditions, as if we’re all just trapped in our local narratives with no access to universal truths. MacIntyre romanticizes ancient communities and traditions, but ignores the fact that plenty of those upheld horrifying practices—like slavery, misogyny, or human sacrifice—and calling those ‘virtuous’ just because they…
Often people are justifying moral systems that make sense overall but contain individual values that are grandfathered in, but maybe don’t make as much sense as the rest. There is a resistance to the kind of clarity that could force you to question some traditional values. Slavery is a good example to think about.