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Rocky Linux 10 Will Support RISC-V

rockylinux.org

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Re: Rocky Linux 10 Will Support RISC-V

#41

Post by jabl »

thebeardisred wrote: post #33
gerdesj wrote: post #10

I understand why people use RH and Rocky and even Oracle: the rpm wranglers. However its not for me. My earliest mainstream distro was RH when they did it just for fun (pre IBM) and then I slid slightly sideways towards Mandrake. I started off with Yggdrassil. I have to do jobs involving RH and co and its just a bit of a pain dealing with elderly stuff. Tomcat ... OK you can have one from 1863. There is a really good…

Hi! I'm sorry this has been your experience. I'm one of the Red Hatters who's been working behind the scenes to get this over the finish line. I do say my genuine thanks for your earnest expression. The version and ABI guarantee is not for everyone. At the same time some folks around these parts know that I'm "not an apologist for running an out of date kernel". I can assure you that everything shipped in the forthco…

> The version and ABI guarantee is not for everyone.

As an aside, that kABI guarantee only goes so far. I work in HPC/AI, and the out-of-tree drivers we use like MOFED and Lustre drivers would break with EVERY SINGLE RHEL minor update (like RHEL X.Y -> X.(Y+1) ). Using past form here because I haven't been using RHEL for this purpose for the past ~5 years, so maybe it has changed since although I doubt it.

Re: Rocky Linux 10 Will Support RISC-V

#42

Post by ChocolateGod »

nine_k wrote: post #21
hshdhdhj4444 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t Ubuntu basically killing apt? My Ubuntu became unusable because it kept insisting on installing a snap version of Firefox breaking a whole bunch of workflows. I do want to try a RH based OS (maybe Fedora) so they don’t keep changing things on me, but just where I am in life right now I don’t have the time/energy to do so, so for now I’m relying on my Mac. Hopefully I can try a new Linux distro in a few months,…

I've heard many good things about Pop OS. It's like Ubuntu done right, and it does have an apt package for Firefox. (I run Void myself, and stay merrily away from all these complications.)

> It's like Ubuntu done right

But it is Ubuntu?

Re: Rocky Linux 10 Will Support RISC-V

#43

Post by ChocolateGod »

beeflet wrote: post #30
publicmail wrote: post #23

Maybe a dumb question but how do non x86 boards normally boot Linux images in a generic way? When I was in the embedded space, our boards all relied on very specific device tree blobs. Is the same strategy used for these or does it use ACPI or something?

I think windows ARM laptops use UEFI?

They do, Windows Phone even use UEFI (not sure was completely compliant) back in the day.

Re: Rocky Linux 10 Will Support RISC-V

#44

Post by ChocolateGod »

Arnavion wrote: post #34
publicmail wrote: post #23

Maybe a dumb question but how do non x86 boards normally boot Linux images in a generic way? When I was in the embedded space, our boards all relied on very specific device tree blobs. Is the same strategy used for these or does it use ACPI or something?

All RISC-V consumer boards running Linux also use DT. RISC-V is also working on getting ACPI but primarily for the sake of servers, just like with ARM where ACPI is primarily used for servers (ARM SBBR / ServerReady). ARM Windows laptops only use ACPI because Windows has no interest in DTs, but under Linux these devices are still booted using DT. I don't know for sure, but the usual reason is that these ACPI implemen…

> so supporting them on Linux requires more effort than just writing up the DT.

More effort then producing unique images for every board?

Re: Rocky Linux 10 Will Support RISC-V

#45

Post by jabl »

worthless-trash wrote: post #39
gerdesj wrote: post #10

I understand why people use RH and Rocky and even Oracle: the rpm wranglers. However its not for me. My earliest mainstream distro was RH when they did it just for fun (pre IBM) and then I slid slightly sideways towards Mandrake. I started off with Yggdrassil. I have to do jobs involving RH and co and its just a bit of a pain dealing with elderly stuff. Tomcat ... OK you can have one from 1863. There is a really good…

Disclaimer: I'm very involved in the kernel part of this for $company. The RHEL kernels themselves do see many improvements over time, the code that you'll see when the product goes end of life is considerably updated compared to the original version string that you see in the package name / uname -a. There are customer and partner feature requests, cve fixes and general bug fixes that go in almost every day. The fir…

As I mentioned in another comment on this thread:

> As an aside, that kABI guarantee only goes so far. I work in HPC/AI, and the out-of-tree drivers we use like MOFED and Lustre drivers would break with EVERY SINGLE RHEL minor update (like RHEL X.Y -> X.(Y+1) ). Using past form here because I haven't been using RHEL for this purpose for the past ~5 years, so maybe it has changed since although I doubt it.

I'm not sure what the underlying problem here is, is the kABI guarantee worthless generally or is it just that MOFED and Lustre drivers need to use features not covered by some kind of "kABI stability guarantee"?

Re: Rocky Linux 10 Will Support RISC-V

#46

Post by unmole »

dgfitz wrote: post #27
gerdesj wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've got Ubuntu 22.04 lying around that still update because they are LTS. Ubuntu has a well publicised policy for releases and you will have obviously read them. Try do-release-upgrade. You also mention "OS supplied from a vendor with extensive customization. Apt was dead." How on earth is that Ubuntu's problem?

I cannot update the OS per the contract. It’s Ubuntu’s problem because they decide they’re smarter than their users and nuke their repos. Fuck all of that.

Sounds made up.

Re: Rocky Linux 10 Will Support RISC-V

#47

Post by [deleted] »

dgfitz wrote: post #11
gerdesj wrote: post #10

I understand why people use RH and Rocky and even Oracle: the rpm wranglers. However its not for me. My earliest mainstream distro was RH when they did it just for fun (pre IBM) and then I slid slightly sideways towards Mandrake. I started off with Yggdrassil. I have to do jobs involving RH and co and its just a bit of a pain dealing with elderly stuff. Tomcat ... OK you can have one from 1863. There is a really good…

I’d rather use redhat than Ubuntu. I was handed a machine the other week with Ubuntu 23.10 on it, OS supplied from a vendor with extensive customization. Apt was dead. Fuck that. At least RH doesn’t kill their repos.

[deleted]

Re: Rocky Linux 10 Will Support RISC-V

#48

Post by viraptor »

dgfitz wrote: post #27
gerdesj wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've got Ubuntu 22.04 lying around that still update because they are LTS. Ubuntu has a well publicised policy for releases and you will have obviously read them. Try do-release-upgrade. You also mention "OS supplied from a vendor with extensive customization. Apt was dead." How on earth is that Ubuntu's problem?

I cannot update the OS per the contract. It’s Ubuntu’s problem because they decide they’re smarter than their users and nuke their repos. Fuck all of that.

The vendor should provide you with updates to the new version, or use LTS. There's absolutely nothing here bad on the Ubuntu part.

Your contract is with the vendor if you have one. Unless you have a contract with Canonical and then you can ask them for support.

Re: Rocky Linux 10 Will Support RISC-V

#49

Post by eddythompson80 »

dgfitz wrote: post #32
dismalaf wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's well publicized that they don't maintain support for old, non-LTS distros. They literally delivered what they promised. Could have been avoided by using an LTS distro. Fedora does the same. No corporate vendor supports 6 month cycle distros for more than a year. RHEL releases come super slowly, for example.

I didn’t have a say in the matter of OS choice, it doesn’t matter how well-publicized Ubuntu’s stance is, it’s wrong. I don’t care if it’s not an LTS, keep the fucking repos open and advertise you’re using an insecure OS. Let me, the user, make that choice. Don’t pretend I’m stupid and need some kind of benevolent dictator to make choices for me, or handicap me because they’re smarter than me. They’re not.

That’s exactly how it works. If you want to use an unsupported, insecure OS, you just have to opt into it.

You opt into it by changing your repositories to the https://old-releases.ubuntu.com archive mirror. You can install and use Ubuntu 6.10 if you want.

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