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ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

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Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#901

Post by shadowgovt »

lazyeye wrote: post #900
shadowgovt wrote: post #899

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The feeling is mutual because much of what you have said applies to the current President as well. For a country that was, ostensibly, as you claim, tired of the government being weaponized for political ends, the President's mental decline being hidden by his lickspittles, and fentanyl and illegal immigration, they sure picked a winner, didn't they? A 78-year-old with obvious deteriorating health who already had the…

Politicians attempting to improve their chances at elections is about as far from a conspiracy theory as you can get. (Why were the Dems gaslighting the public about how "difficult" it was to solve the border problem? For years we've heard ...."We need legislation! We need more money!"). Trump closed the border within weeks so clearly the Dems were lying through their teeth (nobody is shocked, the Dems have been lyin…

The conspiracy theory is that the immigration policy is about encouraging demographic shift because it benefits some politicians over others (as opposed to other explanations such as "There's only but so much you can do to discourage immigration before it crosses over into 'cruelty unbecoming a civilized society'"). It really doesn't hold up to scrutiny of either evidence (Latinos supported Trump significantly in the 2024 election) or common sense ("if immigrants cause problems, wouldn't politicians supporting free immigration lose votes, not gain them? So you end up with a state with more representation but then you hand the representation immediately to the other party? Who benefits?").

> Trump closed the border within weeks

Then what happened?

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-05-13/the-us-tr...

Here's a counter-hypothesis: Maybe the Dems didn't do that when they were in power because it was a very stupid idea. There are many, many ways to "solve" the border problem that leave the country far worse off than when the problem was just unsolved. What is your trust level in this administration finding them?

> We are in the very early stages of major change and disruption

On this, we agree. Though I suspect you're thinking more "new, better America" and I'm thinking "Fall of Rome." His last term ended with a barely-managed pandemic; maybe he can top himself in round 2.

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#902

Post by lazyeye »

shadowgovt wrote: post #901
lazyeye wrote: post #900

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Politicians attempting to improve their chances at elections is about as far from a conspiracy theory as you can get. (Why were the Dems gaslighting the public about how "difficult" it was to solve the border problem? For years we've heard ...."We need legislation! We need more money!"). Trump closed the border within weeks so clearly the Dems were lying through their teeth (nobody is shocked, the Dems have been lyin…

The conspiracy theory is that the immigration policy is about encouraging demographic shift because it benefits some politicians over others (as opposed to other explanations such as "There's only but so much you can do to discourage immigration before it crosses over into 'cruelty unbecoming a civilized society'"). It really doesn't hold up to scrutiny of either evidence (Latinos supported Trump significantly in the…

If you scroll down on this page you can see the historical trend for the latino demographic:-

https://www.as-coa.org/articles/how-latinos-voted-2024-us-pr...

Note in the 2020 election more than double the number of Latinos voted Democrat over Republican. With the massive levels of illegal immigration under the Biden open border policy, the demographic voting shift would have likely happened in the medium term as the millions of illegals slowly merged into the legal population (from 5 years onwards). And of course, within a year or two the Dems would have been clamouring to have the illegals made into citizens.

I think the Dems thought they could get away with it because they had enough of the media on their side (CNN, NYT etc) to carry water for them. But with podcasts, social media etc the media landscape has changed drastically and they weren't able to control the narrative the way they have previously. And this was particularly catastrophic given Kamala Harris was such a poor candidate seemingly pathologically incapable of saying anything beyond rehearsed talking points (and as a consequence largely avoided podcasts).

We can come back in year and everything could be amazing but based on what I've seen so far, I'm sure you would come up with some tortured logic as to why up is down, black is white and it's the worst economy ever etc...

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#903

Post by shadowgovt »

lazyeye wrote: post #902
shadowgovt wrote: post #901

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The conspiracy theory is that the immigration policy is about encouraging demographic shift because it benefits some politicians over others (as opposed to other explanations such as "There's only but so much you can do to discourage immigration before it crosses over into 'cruelty unbecoming a civilized society'"). It really doesn't hold up to scrutiny of either evidence (Latinos supported Trump significantly in the…

If you scroll down on this page you can see the historical trend for the latino demographic:- https://www.as-coa.org/articles/how-latinos-voted-2024-us-pr... Note in the 2020 election more than double the number of Latinos voted Democrat over Republican. With the massive levels of illegal immigration under the Biden open border policy, the demographic voting shift would have likely happened in the medium term as the…

If we're still deporting cancer patients mid-treatment, things can't be amazing in a year somewhat by definition. It's not the logic that's being tortured; it's human beings.

When did we become a nation so cowardly that we have to deport sick kids to feel safe?

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#904

Post by lazyeye »

shadowgovt wrote: post #903
lazyeye wrote: post #902

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you scroll down on this page you can see the historical trend for the latino demographic:- https://www.as-coa.org/articles/how-latinos-voted-2024-us-pr... Note in the 2020 election more than double the number of Latinos voted Democrat over Republican. With the massive levels of illegal immigration under the Biden open border policy, the demographic voting shift would have likely happened in the medium term as the…

If we're still deporting cancer patients mid-treatment, things can't be amazing in a year somewhat by definition. It's not the logic that's being tortured; it's human beings. When did we become a nation so cowardly that we have to deport sick kids to feel safe?

Neither of us have the faintest clue what the actual specific details were of this situation you are attempting use as some form of emotional blackmail. The utterly corrupt Biden administration allowed millions of illegals into this country to sway the voter demographics in their favor. This situation is 100% on them, the current administration is simply attempting to clean up their mess.

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#905

Post by shadowgovt »

lazyeye wrote: post #904
shadowgovt wrote: post #903

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we're still deporting cancer patients mid-treatment, things can't be amazing in a year somewhat by definition. It's not the logic that's being tortured; it's human beings. When did we become a nation so cowardly that we have to deport sick kids to feel safe?

Neither of us have the faintest clue what the actual specific details were of this situation you are attempting use as some form of emotional blackmail. The utterly corrupt Biden administration allowed millions of illegals into this country to sway the voter demographics in their favor. This situation is 100% on them, the current administration is simply attempting to clean up their mess.

If you're trying to assert this isn't a child with cancer (and an American citizen) being sent out of the country before his treatment is over, present evidence. Otherwise you're trying to ignore the facts in your face by deflecting and equivocation. Which you must if you hope to maintain this endeavor to defend the administration, because the facts are monstrous.

I've seen your other posts on other threads. You are attempting to cope with the wheels coming off of the United States by shutting your eyes to the news. It has to be lies, because if it's not lies then what this administration is doing is an existential threat, and you'd much rather not be facing an existential threat. I get that. It sucks being in the middle of history.

I will entertain for a bit accepting your premise that there is a national threat on the border and something must be done (I think it's a flimsy premise; I think these immigration laws are an attempt to build a beaver dam against a rising tide of demographic shift globally, and their incompatibility with the reality on the ground is demonstrated in their inability to be enforced; I think Americans get, at some fundamental level, that we don't get to enforce border constraints like a scared ethnostate while at the same time being America, but we aren't willing to admit that to ourselves yet).

It is entirely possible for the goal to be just, but the process to be monstrous and the administrator to be too stupid to find a balance between efficacy and mercy. You kicked off this subthread by interjecting that people should have just enforced the law. Well here we are. This is what enforcement looks like. It is not the people we want to be.

If previous administrations didn't do this? Good. That was wise leadership that we replaced with a fool.

(Concretely, in this situation: they simply could have let them stay until the treatment was complete. That is always a choice. The executive has broad leeway over enforcement, and that's a feature not a bug.)

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#906

Post by lazyeye »

shadowgovt wrote: post #905
lazyeye wrote: post #904

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Neither of us have the faintest clue what the actual specific details were of this situation you are attempting use as some form of emotional blackmail. The utterly corrupt Biden administration allowed millions of illegals into this country to sway the voter demographics in their favor. This situation is 100% on them, the current administration is simply attempting to clean up their mess.

If you're trying to assert this isn't a child with cancer (and an American citizen) being sent out of the country before his treatment is over, present evidence. Otherwise you're trying to ignore the facts in your face by deflecting and equivocation. Which you must if you hope to maintain this endeavor to defend the administration, because the facts are monstrous. I've seen your other posts on other threads. You are…

Sorry but I'm simply not wasting any more time on this. You've addressed none of the points I've made, none of the extraordinarily corrupt behaviour of the previous admin and you are completely detached from reality on almost all issues of significance. Your arguments are weak and immature. I could equally make a moral argument about the enormous harm caused by the previous administration on so many levels but you'll of course, ignore that and focus on the one scenario you believes supports your case. I'II leave you to have the last word as it's clearly a waste of time engaging with you.

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#907

Post by shadowgovt »

lazyeye wrote: post #906
shadowgovt wrote: post #905

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're trying to assert this isn't a child with cancer (and an American citizen) being sent out of the country before his treatment is over, present evidence. Otherwise you're trying to ignore the facts in your face by deflecting and equivocation. Which you must if you hope to maintain this endeavor to defend the administration, because the facts are monstrous. I've seen your other posts on other threads. You are…

Sorry but I'm simply not wasting any more time on this. You've addressed none of the points I've made, none of the extraordinarily corrupt behaviour of the previous admin and you are completely detached from reality on almost all issues of significance. Your arguments are weak and immature. I could equally make a moral argument about the enormous harm caused by the previous administration on so many levels but you'll…

I actually don't think you can make that argument, so I agree. Good stopping point.

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#908

Post by lazyeye »

shadowgovt wrote: post #907
lazyeye wrote: post #906

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry but I'm simply not wasting any more time on this. You've addressed none of the points I've made, none of the extraordinarily corrupt behaviour of the previous admin and you are completely detached from reality on almost all issues of significance. Your arguments are weak and immature. I could equally make a moral argument about the enormous harm caused by the previous administration on so many levels but you'll…

I actually don't think you can make that argument, so I agree. Good stopping point.

Of course you don't.
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