A Research Preview of Codex

Post by tazjin » Sat, May 17, 2025, 9:09 AM UTC

sam0x17 wrote: post #171

criddell wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you aren't hiring junior engineers to do these kinds of things, where do you think the senior engineers you need in the future will come from? My kid recently graduated from a very good school with a degree in computer science and what she's told me about the job market is scary. It seems that, relatively speaking, there's a lot of postings for senior engineers and very little for new grads. My employer has hired…

Hiring of juniors is basically dead these days and it has been like this for about 10 years and I hate it. I remember when I was a junior in 2014 there were actually startups who would hire cohorts of juniors (like 10 at a time, fresh out of CS degree sort of folks with almost no applied coding experience) and then train them up to senior for a few years, and then a small number will stay and the rest will go elsewhe…

Post by eru » Sat, May 17, 2025, 9:20 AM UTC

oytis wrote: post #227

dgb23 wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recently read an article about the US having a relatively weak occupational training. To contrast, CH and GER are known to have very robust and regulated apprenticeship programs. Meaning you start working at a much earlier age (16) and go to vocational school at the same time for about 4 years. This path is then supported with all kinds of educational stepping stones later down the line. There are many software dev…

I know about this system, but I am not convinced it can work in such a dynamic field as software. When tools change all the time, you need strong fundamentals to stay afloat - which is what universities provide. Vocational training focusing on immediate fit for the market is great for companies that want to extract maximal immediate value from labour for minimal cost, but longer term is not good for engineers themsel…

Post by eru » Sat, May 17, 2025, 9:22 AM UTC

dorian-graph wrote: post #188

_bin_ wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a bit of a game theory problem. "Training senior engineers" is an expensive and thankless task: you bear essentially all the cost, and most of the total benefit accrues to others as a positive externality. Griping at companies that they should undertake to provide this positive externality isn't really a constructive solution. I think some people are betting on the fact that AI can replace junior devs in 2-5…

This hyper-fixation on replacing engineers in writing code is hilarious, and dangerous, to me. Many people, even in tech companies, have no idea how software is built, maintained, and run. I think instead we should focus on getting rid of managers and product owners.

Post by eru » Sat, May 17, 2025, 9:24 AM UTC

skatanski wrote: post #368

al_borland wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That sounds like a dangerous bet.

I’m curious about other aspects of this: - leverage of countries who can host such AI over countries who can’t, will there be a point when countries can’t allow themselves not to have access to „emergency” talent in case they can’t use AI? Recent „choose european”, tariffs show that much of the high end stuff is concentrated in US and China. - outages happen, does the company stop because the cloud is not working? -…

Post by eru » Sat, May 17, 2025, 9:27 AM UTC

lmm wrote: post #301

_bin_ wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I see it, it's actually the only safe bet. Case 1: you keep training engineers. Case 1.1: AGI soon, you don't need juniors or seniors besides a very few. You cost yourself a ton of money that competitors can reinvest into R&D, use to undercut your prices, or return to keep their investors happy. Case 1.2: No AGI. Wages rise, a lot. You must remain in line with that to avoid losing those engineers you trained. Case…

> Case 1.2: No AGI. Wages rise, a lot. You must remain in line with that to avoid losing those engineers you trained. No you don't. Most engineers are shy, conflict-averse, and hate change. You can keep underpaying them and most of them will stay.