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A Tor of the Dark Web

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71–80 of 212 posts

Re: A Tor of the Dark Web

#71
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

freely allowed to say really anything Well, that's allowed on the normal internet for the most part.

That is utter nonsense. I don't even know where to begin. Technically, you can say whatever you want, but you cannot expect to avoid persecution (or prosecution) if you do.

And in most forums, you can't even say whatever you want. You'll be censored by the site hosting the forum, by the hosting company (for web sites), or ISPs.

Re: A Tor of the Dark Web

#72
post #44
post #27

Yes, I know I shouldn't say it out loud, but here I am saying it (take me, Police) - out of curiosity, I went to Hard Candy section of The Hidden Wiki. (Yes, it is exactly what you would think it is.) GOD. There are seriously forums full of pedofiles sharing pictures and - maybe worse? - their stories and wisdoms. Maybe out of utter fascination, I spend about few hours on there and I felt like I want to murder all hu…

I didn't click through the links described (or even have time to install Tor), but it occurs to me that one may be able to find these guys via statistical analysis of writing style. Spider the web and then correlate less-anonymous writings with the stuff the ringleaders are saying on the Darknet.

You can to a certain degree, yeah. There was a project in the UK that looked at using NLP to determine what age/gender child groomers are (to see if they were adults impersonating children in order to befriend children online). It was pretty successful (the Isis project - see http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=pedophile-p... for an overview). The problem is that doing this sort of thing "live" is ethically dubious - not only for the privacy of the child but also for the privacy of the potential offender (because being labelled paedophile is probably one of the worst things you can be labelled - imagine if you are falsely accused).

So yeah, you'd need a huge amount of certainty that this was "the guy", and, frankly, storing enough data about individual writing styles for comparison means it's highly unlikely (right now) that this would be possible to do from a technical perspective, and potentially ethically dubious even if the technology were there - what constitutes "public data" on the internet from a privacy and data protection perspective?

Re: A Tor of the Dark Web

#73
post #66
post #27

Yes, I know I shouldn't say it out loud, but here I am saying it (take me, Police) - out of curiosity, I went to Hard Candy section of The Hidden Wiki. (Yes, it is exactly what you would think it is.) GOD. There are seriously forums full of pedofiles sharing pictures and - maybe worse? - their stories and wisdoms. Maybe out of utter fascination, I spend about few hours on there and I felt like I want to murder all hu…

...just shows that Tor is really anonymous and safe. It shows that the groups who go after and prosecute these people don't have the resources or motivation to get to all of them. When you have a very significant target of the US (near the wanted level of Bin Landen) or China talking freely on Tor without getting caught, then perhaps you can rule it as being seriously anonymous. I don't know about other countries, bu…

This is an important point. The anonymity of Tor relies on finding safety in numbers (or rather, among numbers).

However, the bar doesn't have to be quite that high in order for Tor to be considered de-facto anonymous. There is an order of magnitude separating the resources available to a local police force and the entire DoD. Criminals guilty of capital offenses might only garner the attention of the former, whereas someone at a 'Bin Laden' level of notoriety would be chased with the near-limitless resources of a superpower's defense apparatus.

Re: A Tor of the Dark Web

#74
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't think that enabling them to discuss it, enables them to carry it out? Who's the more effective child predator: the one who does it alone, with little guidance or feedback from others; or the guy who spends time discussing it with a supportive peer group and perhaps carrying out predation with their help? The only value to such a forum is for monitoring and catching them. If by definition the forum isn't use…

I'm not sure you have a basis to make the assumption that the forum leads to more predation. What if it works the opposite? We know that violent movies lead to lower violent crime rates, because the criminals who would be out committing violent crimes are instead enjoying going and seeing this movie. The same could be true of people who might otherwise act on their intentions for predation, but are instead satisfied…

The US DOJ has released this excellent memo on why child pornography is illegal, despite the lack of an "obvious" victim (you've probably seen arguments along those lines for why it should be legal if you read Slashdot or Reddit at all):

[HUGE TRIGGER WARNING FOR DESCRIPTION OF ABUSE]

http://www.justice.gov/criminal/ceos/downloads/ReluctantRebe...

The basic reason why the "give them a safe outlet" arguments don't hold water is because it normalizes the behaviour as they discuss it with like-minded individuals, which leads to easier rationalization and more abuse.

Re: A Tor of the Dark Web

#75
post #60
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't click through the links described (or even have time to install Tor), but it occurs to me that one may be able to find these guys via statistical analysis of writing style. Spider the web and then correlate less-anonymous writings with the stuff the ringleaders are saying on the Darknet.

Perhaps that would work, but taking that idea one step further: I doubt that there's anything you could do to them legally, because the evidence of a similar writing style most likely wouldn't hold up in court. IANAL but I think the least you need to prosecute someone for their actions on the internet is an IP and a statement from the ISP that the IP was assigned to this users account at that very moment. And then ag…

A judge ruled that an IP is not a person: http://techland.time.com/2012/05/07/you-are-not-an-ip-addres...

Re: A Tor of the Dark Web

#76
> They can’t decrypt messages but they are able to track where everything comes from and where it is going. They can’t tell what you’re saying, but they have all they need.

He's talking about SSL here, right? For the record, this is completely incorrect. If "they" have access to a trusted CA (and circumstantial evidence says they do), they can MITM and snoop on whatever they want.

SSL encryption is not secure against state-sponsored attackers and sophisticated criminal enterprises.

Re: A Tor of the Dark Web

#77
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in a metropolitan area of around 500,000 and there are close to 200 markers indicating an IP address that's advertising CP availability. We have methods of rating each marker (e.g. how many CP files, how many are teen, child, nudity vs. intercourse, etc). Of those 200, there are a handful of the worst offenders that law enforcement will use resources to pursue, a group in the middle that have downloaded a larg…

Where are you getting this data from?

Privileged law enforcement information. Sorry but I cannot say more.

Re: A Tor of the Dark Web

#78
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There are more households sharing CP in your community than there are bus stops. Sorry if I'm wrong, but I find that hard to believe. Any amount of CP is a problem IMO, but I don't think it's that bad. In my metropolitan area there's around 1,671,683 people, and I'd be surprised to learn there's 1000 honest-to-god pedos.

I live in a metropolitan area of around 500,000 and there are close to 200 markers indicating an IP address that's advertising CP availability. We have methods of rating each marker (e.g. how many CP files, how many are teen, child, nudity vs. intercourse, etc). Of those 200, there are a handful of the worst offenders that law enforcement will use resources to pursue, a group in the middle that have downloaded a larg…

How do you avoid prosecution? Being in possession of child pornography is a crime. If you personally identified these torrents, then you are essentially confessing.

There is an interesting story in "Three Felonies a Day" where an employer discovers child pornography on an employee's computer. They contact their attorney, and the lawyer deletes the offending contact to protect the company. He then alerts authorities to the employee. The attorney is eventual prosecuted for evidence tampering. It's an absurd Catch 22.

Re: A Tor of the Dark Web

#80
post #27

Yes, I know I shouldn't say it out loud, but here I am saying it (take me, Police) - out of curiosity, I went to Hard Candy section of The Hidden Wiki. (Yes, it is exactly what you would think it is.) GOD. There are seriously forums full of pedofiles sharing pictures and - maybe worse? - their stories and wisdoms. Maybe out of utter fascination, I spend about few hours on there and I felt like I want to murder all hu…

I hope you're not in the UK. Just looking at that stuff, whatever the reason, is enough to get you on the sex offender register here.
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