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Can you trust that permission pop-up on macOS?

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Re: Can you trust that permission pop-up on macOS?

#51

Post by floatrock »

sefrost wrote: post #2

My work Mac regularly pops up an alert box claiming that Slack is “trying to install a new helper tool”. I have no idea why or what it means. I asked IT how I could verify it was legit and they didn’t know. I often wonder if this could also be exploited because it asks for a password and it keeps popping back up every time I click cancel.

Not an os-x developer, but I've always wondered are there any OS guardrails against any (malicious) application showing a window styled the same way as that popup box and just stealing your password?

Re: Can you trust that permission pop-up on macOS?

#52

Post by muppetman »

nmgycombinator wrote: post #48
muppetman wrote: post #45

I remember the I'm a Mac and I'm a PC ads that mocked this on Vista. And now my Mac is worse than Vista. It's so annoying.

Out of curiosity, what do you find annoying about it?

Every time I update an app I have to be told I downloaded it from the Internet and do I trust it. Can this app look on the local network? Constantly being nagged to the point I don't even check/care anymore. Exactly what Vista used to do.

Re: Can you trust that permission pop-up on macOS?

#53

Post by bigyabai »

nmgycombinator wrote: post #48
muppetman wrote: post #45

I remember the I'm a Mac and I'm a PC ads that mocked this on Vista. And now my Mac is worse than Vista. It's so annoying.

Out of curiosity, what do you find annoying about it?

Oh god, don't get me started...

1. iCloud nags never go away if you don't log into iCloud

2. Apple Music is just an advertisement by default and "conveniently" opens every sound file mimetype

3. Functionally useless subscription slopware like AppleTV+ comes installed by-default for no reason

4. Package management is a colossal clusterfuck that can't even enforce package parity across system architectures

5. Apple still doesn't trust their users enough to have modern amenities like a native Vulkan runtime or Nvidia GPU drivers

Vista was terrible, but it didn't suffer from this level of identity crisis.

Re: Can you trust that permission pop-up on macOS?

#54

Post by nmgycombinator »

muppetman wrote: post #52
nmgycombinator wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Out of curiosity, what do you find annoying about it?

Every time I update an app I have to be told I downloaded it from the Internet and do I trust it. Can this app look on the local network? Constantly being nagged to the point I don't even check/care anymore. Exactly what Vista used to do.

The local network popup thing is too overdone in my opinion. However, I do think it is a good choice (in some respects) for Apple to have the "this is a program downloaded from the Internet", even if it can be annoying. It might also be a push to get developers to publish on the App Store (where Apple can be more sure (hopefully) that the apps are safe).

It's a double-edged sword in my opinion. I think it's good that the OS is looking out for the user in a lot of cases. I also understand how it can give the users pop-up fatigue.

Re: Can you trust that permission pop-up on macOS?

#56

Post by nmgycombinator »

bigyabai wrote: post #53
nmgycombinator wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Out of curiosity, what do you find annoying about it?

Oh god, don't get me started... 1. iCloud nags never go away if you don't log into iCloud 2. Apple Music is just an advertisement by default and "conveniently" opens every sound file mimetype 3. Functionally useless subscription slopware like AppleTV+ comes installed by-default for no reason 4. Package management is a colossal clusterfuck that can't even enforce package parity across system architectures 5. Apple sti…

I agree that it's weird that Apple TV comes pre-installed. The others I have less experience with so I can't really comment on them.

Re: Can you trust that permission pop-up on macOS?

#57

Post by bigyabai »

nmgycombinator wrote: post #54
muppetman wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every time I update an app I have to be told I downloaded it from the Internet and do I trust it. Can this app look on the local network? Constantly being nagged to the point I don't even check/care anymore. Exactly what Vista used to do.

The local network popup thing is too overdone in my opinion. However, I do think it is a good choice (in some respects) for Apple to have the "this is a program downloaded from the Internet", even if it can be annoying. It might also be a push to get developers to publish on the App Store (where Apple can be more sure (hopefully) that the apps are safe). It's a double-edged sword in my opinion. I think it's good that…

> It might also be a push to get developers to publish on the App Store (where Apple can be more sure (hopefully) that the apps are safe).

This is exploitation of developers, plain and simple. Apple should secure their runtime, not roleplay as a software rent-a-cop that manually (and fallibly) inspects submissions. The App Store is a blatant moneymaking racket, on mobile and desktop alike. "Security" is a fig leaf for the perverse incentive Apple has to corral developers under their thumb.

Re: Can you trust that permission pop-up on macOS?

#58

Post by trollbridge »

nmgycombinator wrote: post #54
muppetman wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every time I update an app I have to be told I downloaded it from the Internet and do I trust it. Can this app look on the local network? Constantly being nagged to the point I don't even check/care anymore. Exactly what Vista used to do.

The local network popup thing is too overdone in my opinion. However, I do think it is a good choice (in some respects) for Apple to have the "this is a program downloaded from the Internet", even if it can be annoying. It might also be a push to get developers to publish on the App Store (where Apple can be more sure (hopefully) that the apps are safe). It's a double-edged sword in my opinion. I think it's good that…

I simply run `xattr -d downloaded-app.dmg` on apps I download that I trust to turn off this behaviour.

Re: Can you trust that permission pop-up on macOS?

#59

Post by nmgycombinator »

bigyabai wrote: post #57
nmgycombinator wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The local network popup thing is too overdone in my opinion. However, I do think it is a good choice (in some respects) for Apple to have the "this is a program downloaded from the Internet", even if it can be annoying. It might also be a push to get developers to publish on the App Store (where Apple can be more sure (hopefully) that the apps are safe). It's a double-edged sword in my opinion. I think it's good that…

> It might also be a push to get developers to publish on the App Store (where Apple can be more sure (hopefully) that the apps are safe). This is exploitation of developers, plain and simple. Apple should secure their runtime, not roleplay as a software rent-a-cop that manually (and fallibly) inspects submissions. The App Store is a blatant moneymaking racket, on mobile and desktop alike. "Security" is a fig leaf fo…

Honestly, I think you have a fair point there. I personally don't believe that any system could be 100% secure. But I do think there is a point to be made on the efficacy of securing the runtime compared to individual app inspection.

Re: Can you trust that permission pop-up on macOS?

#60

Post by tough »

bigyabai wrote: post #53
nmgycombinator wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Out of curiosity, what do you find annoying about it?

Oh god, don't get me started... 1. iCloud nags never go away if you don't log into iCloud 2. Apple Music is just an advertisement by default and "conveniently" opens every sound file mimetype 3. Functionally useless subscription slopware like AppleTV+ comes installed by-default for no reason 4. Package management is a colossal clusterfuck that can't even enforce package parity across system architectures 5. Apple sti…

you might like https://github.com/philocalyst/infat to change the mimetypes associations
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