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US vs. Google amicus curiae brief of Y Combinator in support of plaintiffs [pdf]

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Re: US vs. Google amicus curiae brief of Y Combinator in support of plaintiffs [pdf]

#251
post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Monopolies should be broken up” doesn’t imply we should disincentivize research though, does it?

I think the implication is that in a high competition area Noone has the spare funds for massive research projects that may go nowhere

[deleted]

Re: US vs. Google amicus curiae brief of Y Combinator in support of plaintiffs [pdf]

#252
post #31

Google is the reason for the current AI boom. Without the transformer architecture they invented by funding basic research, there would be no modern LLMs. YC is arguing that their incentive for funding that basic research should be taken away in order to spur innovation?

> YC is arguing that their incentive for funding that basic research should be taken away in order to spur innovation?

Ma Bell is arguing that Bell labs has been a fountain of knowledge everyone admires and has contributed tremendously to the advancement of telecommunication systems.

Re: US vs. Google amicus curiae brief of Y Combinator in support of plaintiffs [pdf]

#253
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have two major phone operating systems and they charge a tax of 30%, which gets passed onto consumers. This should be zero if there was unlimited competition or web installation. There's also so much innovation happening in the mobile space right now. It's not like they're parked and reaping untold benefits. By having search monopolies, they've gamified paying for placement above your competitor's trademarks. Rath…

Ironically, Google has always allowed people to side-step the 30% tax.

With a burried setting and scare wall that they know fewer than 0.01% engage with.

Re: US vs. Google amicus curiae brief of Y Combinator in support of plaintiffs [pdf]

#254
post #31

Google is the reason for the current AI boom. Without the transformer architecture they invented by funding basic research, there would be no modern LLMs. YC is arguing that their incentive for funding that basic research should be taken away in order to spur innovation?

Kings and nobles funded many scientists, do want to take their money and power away?

Re: US vs. Google amicus curiae brief of Y Combinator in support of plaintiffs [pdf]

#255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is why, like the 'monopoly on violence' the government should also be funding a _lot more research_. It should be at, or partnered with, higher learning institutions and since it's public funded all of the results should be free to use*. I'm willing to entertain the idea of: Free use for people and corporations within the country/countries that funded research, everyone else pays compulsory license fees.

But public funded research isn’t “free to use.” In many cases, you can’t even read it without paying a scientific journal for a subscription. See the Bayh-Dole Act as well: universities can patent discoveries from federally funded research.

There’s no reason that couldn’t be changed, e.g. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43858568.

Re: US vs. Google amicus curiae brief of Y Combinator in support of plaintiffs [pdf]

#256
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have two major phone operating systems and they charge a tax of 30%, which gets passed onto consumers. This should be zero if there was unlimited competition or web installation. There's also so much innovation happening in the mobile space right now. It's not like they're parked and reaping untold benefits. By having search monopolies, they've gamified paying for placement above your competitor's trademarks. Rath…

Free apps don’t cost any “tax.” > This should be zero if there was unlimited competition or web installation Is credit card processing, billing, storage, distribution, “free?” And the 30% figure is inaccurate. Most developers don’t pay that. How about stripe charging 2.9% +$0.30 per transaction? They are almost double the actual cost of the interchanges.

Businesses have hundreds of billing and payment options, and the fees are relatively small and straightforward.

Google and Apple charge an order of magnitude more for a straightjacket distribution mechanism that is inferior to web search.

Re: US vs. Google amicus curiae brief of Y Combinator in support of plaintiffs [pdf]

#257

This feels a bit like cutting off your nose to spite your face... Unlike Microsoft's antitrust case of the 90s, Google seems much less anti-competitive by nature. Sure, they have unprecedented scale in search... but even that hegemony is being threatened by others in AI. If anything, going after Google with a DoJ kludgel will cause a servere freeze on startup M&A across all of FAANG. With IPO windows (mostly) closed,…

Google killed the Edge browser with the same tricks MS used.

The use money and Google Play services to hinder competition.

Not really less anti-competitive.

Re: US vs. Google amicus curiae brief of Y Combinator in support of plaintiffs [pdf]

#258

The solution proposed by Kagi—separate the search index from the rest of Google—seems to make the most sense. Kagi explains it more here: https://blog.kagi.com/dawn-new-era-search

Crawling the internet is a natural monopoly. Nobody wants an endless stream of bots crawling their site, so googlebot wins because they’re the dominant search engine. It makes sense to break that out so everyone has access to the same dataset at FRAND pricing. My heart just wants Google to burn to the ground, but my brain says this is the more reasonable approach.

> so googlebot wins because they’re the dominant search engine.

I think it's also important to highlight that sites explicitly choose which bots to allow in their robots.txt files, prioritizing Google which reinforces its position as the de-facto monopoly. Even when other bots are technically able to crawl them.

Re: US vs. Google amicus curiae brief of Y Combinator in support of plaintiffs [pdf]

#259
post #190

How much things have changed when antitrust used mean unfair practices by real monopolies. Real monopolies. Standard Oil which you had no choice in what gas you used. The Bell System(ATT) controlled all of long distance, you had no choice to use them for making long distance calls. Microsoft owned 95% of the market when they got with antitrust, there was other OSes but your software wouldn't run on those OSes. Consum…

I haven’t looked at the merits, and I don’t like what the EU is doing to US companies with 20% market share, but I remember feeling the same way about Microsoft over 20 years ago. Fortunately, groklaw provided a constant stream of easily readable, high quality content. That, and I could see some of my favorite companies shutting down because their customers were restricted from doing business with them if they wanted…

This is to separate search index from Google.

Ad is even worse as Google doesn’t even control the majority of digital marketing market. Only case i can think of is the Amex case but Supreme Court rightly found you can’t be an abusive monopoly and have less than a majority of the market.

Re: US vs. Google amicus curiae brief of Y Combinator in support of plaintiffs [pdf]

#260
post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The biggest funders of basic research are those with the most resources. This is your insight? I don't think anyone disagrees. Then you conflate correlation with causation and move it to _monopolies_ fund basic research. Bravo.

Major monopolies tend to have the most resources, particularly excess resources that are available to spend on things like research.

That’s not suprising at all, though. It doesn’t imply that monopolies are a net benefit for society.
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