Related: https://catholicreview.org/chicago-native-cardinal-prevost-e...
(via https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43928742, but we merged that thread hither)
First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV
341–350 of 1001 posts
Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV
#342Some jokes I saw on Reddit: He is to be referred to as, "Da Pope." "Ketchup to be banned in the Vatican." "He's going to replace Communion Wine with Malört."
Deep dish pizza, I'm not so sure is going to find many fans in Rome. Just put a cover on top of it and call it a calzone, I guess.
Do people actually think deep dish is the only kind of pizza people eat in Chicago? I thought that was a meme.
Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV
#343Earlier quoted context omitted.
No fan of the RC church here but I didn't hear any mocking. Just pointing out a counterfactual experience.
No one would have this loaded tone when counteracting someone's trauma in ANY subject - besides that of religion. It is a subject with a uniquely deep entrenchment of someone's fundamental life experiences and beliefs, and is the only subject where someone would have the gall to do such a thing; out of defense of, what they believe, is their very essence as a person. There is absolutely no shot that someone would res…
There was no mention of sexual abuse.
Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV
#344"Whereas Francis said, “Who am I to judge?” when asked about gay clerics, Cardinal Prevost has expressed less welcoming views to L.G.B.T.Q. people. In a 2012 address to bishops, he lamented that Western news media and popular culture fostered “sympathy for beliefs and practices that are at odds with the gospel.” He cited the “homosexual lifestyle” and “alternative families comprised of same-sex partners and their ado…
Curious, do you think he's wrong that it's at odds with what was taught by the apostles? It's obviously unpopular, but I have yet to see a convincing argument (based in the teachings of the Bible) that promotes same-sex marriages. If I were in his position, and part of my duty is to interpret and lead via "the holy scriptures," then I would probably want to be as accurate as possible.
When did Jesus say ANYTHING about homosexuality?
Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV
#345Earlier quoted context omitted.
> my duty is to interpret and lead via "the holy scriptures" Said scriptures also says that a woman can be sold to her rapist after he violates her. I think a more modern interpretation would not be a bad idea.
Not the New Testament. Christianity has the luxury (compared to some other religions..) of having very few "divinely ordained" rules. The teachings of Jesus supersede the stuff from the Old testament (the one with all not very nice things) however they are rather vague and undefined. So various churches can freely pick/discard almost whatever they want besides the 10 commandments while Muslims can't exactly just thro…
Jesus never said he was superseding a single thing. His entire ministry was about railing against the legalistic structure of the Pharisees, who were more interested in following "the Law" than having common sense or taking care of people. His ministry was about Jews, for Jews, and had nothing to do with gentiles at all. The grifter Paul is the one who opened up their cult to gentiles.
Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV
#346> "Cardinal George of Chicago, of happy memory, was one of my great mentors, and he said: 'Look, until America goes into political decline, there won't be an American pope.' And his point was, if America is kind of running the world politically, culturally, economically, they don't want America running the world religiously. So, I think there's some truth to that, that we're such a superpower and so dominant, they do…
For what it’s worth, I was just reading that Leo wasn’t seen as “completely” American due to his many years in Peru — he’s even a citizen. Take that as you will.
1955 born (chicago)
1977 seminary grad (chicago)
1982 ordination (->rome)
1985 canon law doctor (->peru)
1999 midwest augustinians (->chicago)
2001 global augustinians (->rome)
2015 bishop (->peru)
2021 dicasterate (->rome)Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV
#347Earlier quoted context omitted.
From reading online comments, I'm starting to believe that those who reside outside the US are more strident defenders of the idea that "US citizens only" = "American" than US citizens themselves.
Not in Central America. We call US citizens "Gringos" Unfortunately, this does carry a variable negative weight. Now, Latin Americans living in the US proudly call themselves "Americans" Edit: Albeit long, the correct gentilice for the US is "Estadounidenses" as in "Estados Unidos de América"
"Estadounidense" is also a bit odd, since there are Los Estados Unidos Mexicanos (the formal name for Mexico). I don't think it is likely to confuse very many people, but still odd.
Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV
#348Earlier quoted context omitted.
[flagged]
No fan of the RC church here but I didn't hear any mocking. Just pointing out a counterfactual experience.
Honestly not even sure it's meant to be a counterfactual experience, just more pointing out that the original comment isn't really germane.
"The aesthetics of $THING are really very impressive whether you believe the underlying mythology or not."
"Yeah well I had a bad experience with $THING so I don't get any joy out of it all because it's dark and sinister!"
...ok? What's the response to something like that supposed to be? Is this Reddit where we should fall over each other to apologize to someone we've never met about a thing that theoretically happened decades ago and also presumably happened to hundreds or thousands of other people? It just doesn't make any sense.
Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV
#349Earlier quoted context omitted.
‘I was only following orders.’
A lot of the church abuse scandal happened during a couple of decades when the church's handling of the cases were the result of following the then scientific consensus on the matter. The church was not alone in this. The scientists told us they could be reformed. Just look up the history of what was going on in Germany following the same advice. It's a relatively new thing where we just declare pedophiles unfixable…
I'd wager that the rates of abuse in public schools are not as high as in Catholic schools. I'd go so far as to say that there isn't necessarily anything about Catholicism that produces more pedophiles than normal, and that there aren't necessarily more pedophiles employed by Catholic schools than by others.
However, it seems likely that there's something about the institution that produces more molesters than normal, and clearly there is something about the institution that causes it to lean towards quieting and covering up accusations rather than rectifying them. It doesn't really have anything to do with the reformability of pedophilia; the church faces the necessity of changing either how it handles molesters, or how the nature of its organization seems to create more molesters. The problem is that the church is an institution that seems loathe to change in general.
Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV
#350Earlier quoted context omitted.
How so? The U.S. is the third-largest national Catholic population in the world, and it's by far the single largest national contributor to the Church’s global finances. Plus, anything that can bend the arc of U.S. history toward the Catholic missions of social justice and human rights is going to matter more in the next four years than it ever has.
You're probably talking about Peter's Pence collection contribution which is just pocket change (a few millions). Dioclesian revenue, lease income, Vatican's wealth fund generate billions. Lets not forget state support which the US doesn't have - for example if you register as a catholic in Germany 8-9% of your income tax goes to the church directly - to the tune of about 6 billion per year altogether.
> You're probably talking about Peter's Pence collection contribution which is just pocket change (a few millions).
Pocket change for sure (13.6 million/28.1%, says https://zenit.org/2024/06/30/the-ten-countries-that-made-the...), but there's also U.S. congregational giving of ~$20 billion, and the U.S. is the source of most large Catholic hospital, university, and foundation endowments.