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Buffett to step down following six-decade run atop Berkshire

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Re: Buffett to step down following six-decade run atop Berkshire

#301

Post by iepathos »

arrosenberg wrote: post #291
dragonwriter wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Deteriorating conditions for the working class are the main driver of our push toward authoritarian government. No, they aren't. It's dubious that even the widening relative gap between the working class and the capitalist class plays a major role, though that at least has the virtue of being a real condition and not a fantasy.

If you have an alternative hypothesis, I’m all ears. The lack of good paying jobs and the knock on effects of expanding wealth disparity seems to be underlying most of the issues driving radicalism, left and right, up and down. In America, at least, workers think tomorrow will be worse than today and they are resorting to populism to try and reverse the trend.

I don’t think it’s accurate to say that the working class is “resorting to populism to reverse the trend.” If anything, the fact that so many working-class voters support a wealthy oligarchy—one that consistently advances policies benefiting the super-rich at the expense of ordinary people—suggests that a significant portion of the population is being swayed by misinformation and manipulation, not that they’re successfully advocating for their own interests.

Ironically, it’s often the opposite party that actually pushes for policies that would materially benefit the working class. The real fallacy is equating the current wave of so-called “populism” with a genuine effort to improve conditions for workers. In practice, what’s being called “populism” is frequently just another vehicle for entrenched elites to consolidate power, not a movement to empower ordinary people.

Re: Buffett to step down following six-decade run atop Berkshire

#302

Post by ii41 »

WalterBright wrote: post #281
dehugger wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consider, for a moment, the state that China was in at the conclusion of WW2. It hadn't even industrialized yet. The British and the Japanese absolutely trashed China for over a hundred years! Russia was also not industrialized until after their revolution in ~1920, and suffered horrific losses in the homeland during WW2. The US emerged from WW2 fully industrialized and nearly unscathed. The US mainland remained unto…

China didn't industrialize until after 1978, when they gave up on communism and began a transition to capitalism. Over 30 years after WW2 concluded. Russia did not industrialize in the 1920s. They did collectivize agriculture, famine ensued. They turned back to free market farming, famine went away. They turned again to collectivization, and farming collapsed again. Eventually, the Soviets allowed farmers to farm sma…

Before opening up in 70s, China had acquired the ability to build by itself: huge numbers of machine guns and grenades, tanks, fighter planes, rockets and satellites (aka missiles), nukes.

These minus nukes and missiles plus battleships is pre-WWII Japan.

This may be helpful if you're curious why so many countries that choose free market instead of Communism after WWII are still not industrialized today.

Re: Buffett to step down following six-decade run atop Berkshire

#303

Post by Ey7NFZ3P0nzAe »

WalterBright wrote: post #229
mmooss wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They also get that way by inheriting wealth, by buying favorable laws and regulations, by anticompetitive practices (we've seen a few in the IT sector), and by other problematic behavior. I agree that free markets are great in principle but your comments seem dogmatic - all free markets and only free markets. The conversation would be much more interesting if it was about the nuances.

> They also get that way by inheriting wealth, Then their parents must have been billionaires, generating it with investments. If the inheritors divest from those investments, then they incur enormous income taxes. So it's likely to stay. > by buying favorable laws and regulations, Then it's not free market. There is no government system that is immune from buying influence and corruption. > by anticompetitive practi…

> Then it's not free market. There is no government system that is immune from buying influence and corruption

The point is that if you're forced to put your money into industries / r&d etc then you don't have enough money to bribe people / political parties / news outlets etc.

Re: Buffett to step down following six-decade run atop Berkshire

#304

Post by dragonwriter »

arrosenberg wrote: post #291
dragonwriter wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Deteriorating conditions for the working class are the main driver of our push toward authoritarian government. No, they aren't. It's dubious that even the widening relative gap between the working class and the capitalist class plays a major role, though that at least has the virtue of being a real condition and not a fantasy.

If you have an alternative hypothesis, I’m all ears. The lack of good paying jobs and the knock on effects of expanding wealth disparity seems to be underlying most of the issues driving radicalism, left and right, up and down. In America, at least, workers think tomorrow will be worse than today and they are resorting to populism to try and reverse the trend.

> If you have an alternative hypothesis, I’m all ears.

How about if I let you do that:

> In America, at least, workers think tomorrow will be worse than today and they are resorting to populism to try and reverse the trend.

See, belief about likely future conditions is a very different hypothesis than factually-existing current conditions, and a better one. To the extent that, IMO, its at least part of the actual explanation.

Re: Buffett to step down following six-decade run atop Berkshire

#305

Post by lurk2 »

dragonwriter wrote: post #271
arrosenberg wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Deteriorating conditions for the working class are the main driver of our push toward authoritarian government. A pragmatist would have been more sympathetic for reasons beyond pure capitalist economics.

> Deteriorating conditions for the working class are the main driver of our push toward authoritarian government. No, they aren't. It's dubious that even the widening relative gap between the working class and the capitalist class plays a major role, though that at least has the virtue of being a real condition and not a fantasy.

> It's dubious that even the widening relative gap between the working class and the capitalist class plays a major role

This description could apply to the French Revolution, Tsarist Russia, the fall of the Weimar Republic, and the Colombian Civil War. Why do you think it is dubious?

Re: Buffett to step down following six-decade run atop Berkshire

#306

Post by nandomrumber »

linotype wrote: post #239
arrosenberg wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Deteriorating conditions for the working class are the main driver of our push toward authoritarian government. A pragmatist would have been more sympathetic for reasons beyond pure capitalist economics.

I just don’t buy this argument. By global standards, even the poorest Americans (with obvious exceptions like the homeless) are relatively wealthy. Comparison is the theft of joy.

You say comparison is the theft of joy, and then ask us to compare to an irrelevant metric.

If living standards are falling, grocery prices have increased, rents have gone up, wages have stagnated, what does the price of eggs in China have to do with my assessment of the local conditions.

Re: Buffett to step down following six-decade run atop Berkshire

#307

Post by DavidPiper »

WalterBright wrote: post #283
brookst wrote: post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is painfully naive. Simple, obvious contradiction: can every country enjoy the benefits of issuing the de facto reserve currency for the world? Just by having free markets? The US has been incredibly privileged. I’d argue that was earned in some ways and lucky in others. But it’s undeniably true.

> The US has been incredibly privileged. Free markets are a choice the US made. Any country can choose to have a free market, and some have. The reserve currency thing has nothing to do with it.

Your position that the country controlling the de facto global reserve currency isn't in a privileged economic position is very hard to understand.

What would you say is the economic impact on a country of controlling a global reserve currency?

Re: Buffett to step down following six-decade run atop Berkshire

#308

Post by arrosenberg »

dragonwriter wrote: post #304
arrosenberg wrote: post #291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you have an alternative hypothesis, I’m all ears. The lack of good paying jobs and the knock on effects of expanding wealth disparity seems to be underlying most of the issues driving radicalism, left and right, up and down. In America, at least, workers think tomorrow will be worse than today and they are resorting to populism to try and reverse the trend.

> If you have an alternative hypothesis, I’m all ears. How about if I let you do that: > In America, at least, workers think tomorrow will be worse than today and they are resorting to populism to try and reverse the trend. See, belief about likely future conditions is a very different hypothesis than factually-existing current conditions, and a better one. To the extent that, IMO, its at least part of the actual exp…

It’s the same hypothesis. Its a line trending down, and there is an awareness that today is less than yesterday and more than tomorrow.

Re: Buffett to step down following six-decade run atop Berkshire

#309

Post by lurk2 »

iepathos wrote: post #301
arrosenberg wrote: post #291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you have an alternative hypothesis, I’m all ears. The lack of good paying jobs and the knock on effects of expanding wealth disparity seems to be underlying most of the issues driving radicalism, left and right, up and down. In America, at least, workers think tomorrow will be worse than today and they are resorting to populism to try and reverse the trend.

I don’t think it’s accurate to say that the working class is “resorting to populism to reverse the trend.” If anything, the fact that so many working-class voters support a wealthy oligarchy—one that consistently advances policies benefiting the super-rich at the expense of ordinary people—suggests that a significant portion of the population is being swayed by misinformation and manipulation, not that they’re succes…

> Ironically, it’s often the opposite party that actually pushes for policies that would materially benefit the working class.

Such as?

Re: Buffett to step down following six-decade run atop Berkshire

#310

Post by tasuki »

liamwire wrote: post #246
xboxnolifes wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And no amount of good doctors can make you change your lifestyle. At the end of the day, a ton of doctor advise is ways to change your lifestyle, and that takes personal effort.

Buffet, famously, is known for not having great dietary habits. I agree with you, but he’s not a good example here.

I think he's actually a great example: it's much more complicated than good dietary habits!
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