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New Study: Waymo is reducing serious crashes and making streets safer

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Re: New Study: Waymo is reducing serious crashes and making streets safer

#331

Post by squigz »

sneak wrote: post #292
squigz wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would expect "most roads" to be comprised of residential roads, and I find it hard to believe speeding on those roads is not a safety issue.

The speed limits on most residential roads are too low from a variety of factors, including tradition, policies, and desire for revenue or to generate PC to pull over drivers. You don't drive 25 on residential roads, because you know this to be true. Neither do I, nor does anyone else.

Yeah, well, I don't/can't drive, so maybe my perspective as a pedestrian is just different :)

Do you have any sources to backup your claims that that's too fast and is more unsafe than speeding?

Re: New Study: Waymo is reducing serious crashes and making streets safer

#332

Post by 83 »

bluGill wrote: post #129
83 wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I spend about 5 months every year driving in snow and ice - this is the first I'm hearing about dropping it into neutral. Can you elaborate on when that would be appropriate? Obviously you shouldn't be slamming on the brakes, but they do work fine in snow and ice. I don't see how rolling into things while not in gear is an improvement?

When you let off the throttle your wheels start driving the engine and slowing you down. In snow/ice that engine breaking alone can be more braking force than is safe and so you go into a skid. Shifting to neutral removes engine braking and allows for more controlled slowing down.

When it's those conditions though I just use a light touch on the throttle to make wheel speed match ground speed, a lot of easier than trying to shift in and out of neutral.

Re: New Study: Waymo is reducing serious crashes and making streets safer

#333

Post by d0mine »

rlue wrote: post #273
johnfn wrote: post #37

As someone who is often on SF city streets without a car - I bike and run a lot - I absolutely love Waymo. I am continuously seeing human drivers cut me off, perform illegal maneuvers (i.e. run red lights when I'm going through a crosswalk), and break various other traffic laws. All these things genuinely put people in danger. Just the other day, a guy started running a "no right turn on red" lane in SF, and when I p…

The one time I ever rode in a waymo (in Los Angeles), I had a contradictory experience. My Waymo was attempting to make a right turn at a red light. We were stopped behind a human driver who was waiting for pedestrians to finish crossing before proceeding to make the turn. This was a college campus (UCLA), so there were lots of pedestrians. After a few seconds of waiting, the Waymo decided that the driver ahead of us…

"Safer on average" needs independent validation.

Re: New Study: Waymo is reducing serious crashes and making streets safer

#334

Post by Zigurd »

Lammy wrote: post #116
sollewitt wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fellow SF cyclist: Even setting aside the malicious SF stuff, Waymo's have enormous advantages over humans relying on mirrors and accounting for blindspots. I never have to be concerned a Waymo hasn't seen me. I can't wait until the technology is just standard on cars, and they won't let drivers side-swipe or door cyclists.

> I never have to be concerned a Waymo hasn't seen me. Funnily enough that's exactly why I don't like them. Every time one rolls by me I know that tens of photos of me and even my 3D LIDAR scan get piled in to some fucking Google dataset where it will live forever :/ Their site is even proud of it: https://waymo.com/waymo-driver/ section titled “Keeping an eye on everything, all at once” “The Waymo Driver's perceptio…

There are somewhere between several hundred and a couple thousand Waymo vehicles per city being served. Even if that expands tenfold, it will be a small fraction of the number of cameras you pass by every day.

Re: New Study: Waymo is reducing serious crashes and making streets safer

#335

Post by paul7986 »

Waymo per their track record I trust and am excited to try / use it once it comes to DC or another city close to DC.

All the other big names that are no longer around... their tech was dangerous and definitely not ready for prime time. Their tech and focus seemed all about making all involved wealthy or wealthier.

Re: New Study: Waymo is reducing serious crashes and making streets safer

#336

Post by triceratops »

sidibe wrote: post #237
johnmcd3 wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> * Waymo vehicle entering a dedicated bike lane. In California, California Vehicle Code § 21209(a)(3) expressly permits a motor vehicle to enter a bicycle lane “to prepare for a turn within a distance of 200 feet from the intersection” -- among other cases. (The vehicle must yield to cyclists in the lane.)

I hope that means yield to cyclists ahead of them. To me the whole point of getting in the bike lane is to avoid cases where the cyclist going straight is in a blind spot during the car's right turn. As a cyclist I'll sometimes get into the car lane at intersections to make sure I'm seen. seems like the car being required to let the bike behind them go straight is exactly what you'd want to avoid

Merging into the bike lane before turning right is safer for cyclists. Drivers are supposed to do shoulder checks when changing lanes (I mean they're also supposed to do them when turning but you know) so they likely won't hit a cyclist when merging into the lane.

Once the car is in the bike lane, any bike going straight is forced to remain safely behind the car until the car completes its turn.

Re: New Study: Waymo is reducing serious crashes and making streets safer

#337

Post by happyopossum »

mavhc wrote: post #313
Toenex wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly future generations will be aghast at how we accepted road deaths caused by human drivers.

It's only more than a 9/11 every day of the year

120 traffic deaths per day in the US - not sure where you’re getting your data, but you’re off by more than an order of magnitude

Re: New Study: Waymo is reducing serious crashes and making streets safer

#338

Post by happyopossum »

hombre_fatal wrote: post #321
zdragnar wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nah, insurance companies will change their coverage rates based on the feature, and / or it'll become another legally mandated feature like backup cameras.

On the other hand, I wonder why insurance companies haven't led to the ubiquity of dashcams. I thought by now every vehicle sold would have one built in. And my suspicion is that insurance companies don't push for you to get one because it prevents them from fighting claims that they would've won had there been no evidence. Maybe it's similar for self-driving or whatever we're talking about here (sensors?).

They don’t care because at their scale it would be a wash - you’d only come out ahead if your insured drivers were consistently and significantly better drivers than every other insurance provider you fight claims against.

Re: New Study: Waymo is reducing serious crashes and making streets safer

#339

Post by Zigurd »

biophysboy wrote: post #55
johnfn wrote: post #37

As someone who is often on SF city streets without a car - I bike and run a lot - I absolutely love Waymo. I am continuously seeing human drivers cut me off, perform illegal maneuvers (i.e. run red lights when I'm going through a crosswalk), and break various other traffic laws. All these things genuinely put people in danger. Just the other day, a guy started running a "no right turn on red" lane in SF, and when I p…

I am also hopeful that Waymo has other positive externalities for bikes/pedestrians: less need for parking spots, car ownership, etc. At the same time, I guess you could say the same for rideshare, so it would depend on if robo-rideshare is cheaper than ownership

Ride hailing gameification negates safety benefits. They do monitor for smooth, driving, but that's about it.

Re: New Study: Waymo is reducing serious crashes and making streets safer

#340

Post by xixixao »

SoftTalker wrote: post #330
johnfn wrote: post #37

As someone who is often on SF city streets without a car - I bike and run a lot - I absolutely love Waymo. I am continuously seeing human drivers cut me off, perform illegal maneuvers (i.e. run red lights when I'm going through a crosswalk), and break various other traffic laws. All these things genuinely put people in danger. Just the other day, a guy started running a "no right turn on red" lane in SF, and when I p…

Once pedestrians and cyclists figure out that Waymo cars will always stop or avoid them they will start ignoring crosswalks and signals and just cross or cut in front of them.

Which would be wonderful? (assuming all cars have similar tech at that point)

Basically every street could be a shared space like Exhibition Road[0]. Making the city optimized for cars is a relatively recent development in the history of cities. I say this as a car owner and driver.

[0] https://www.udg.org.uk/publications/articles/exhibition-road...

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