I wish we were off today in the US. This holiday makes me jealous of my international friends :)
The Brief Origins of May Day
41–50 of 260 posts
Re: The Brief Origins of May Day
#42Earlier quoted context omitted.
Then you better not watch any fireworks on Independence Day either
Comparing the American Revolution to random anarchist terrorists throwing bombs into crowds is... certainly something.
The founding fathers would have been called terrorists today by the British. Past the Boston Tea Party, the Green Mountain Boys is a pretty good example. "The Green Mountain Boys stopped sheriffs from enforcing New York laws and terrorized settlers who had New York grants, burning buildings, stealing cattle, and administering occasional floggings with birch rods." - https://www.britannica.com/topic/Green-Mountain-Boys
Re: The Brief Origins of May Day
#43Why don’t labor issues resonate more with tech workers? I know that we’re not a monolith and are actually a heterogeneous mix of opinions, but there frequently talk about job dissatisfaction (career burnout, comically stingy equity grants, etc). But when organizing comes up, it’s usually treated with disdain because so many have bought into highly individualistic hustle-culture and the narrative that unions only exis…
In my experience everyone thinks “we’ve got a good thing here, let’s not ruin it.”
Indeed the bar is so low that even with all the bullshit in the tech industry, we seem to have it better than most- on salary alone. Throw in “full remote” (although that’s disappearing) and it really can’t be beat, even when your boss yells obscenities at you every day.
Re: The Brief Origins of May Day
#44Earlier quoted context omitted.
The vast majority of tech workers I know come from comfortable middle class suburban backgrounds, so I'm not surprised they're anti-union and anti-labor.
A lot of "comfortable middle class suburban" folks I know are in the trades. Hardly anti-union with that group.
But they entered their field with the union already established. Humans won’t fight for a damn thing.
Re: The Brief Origins of May Day
#45Is there any link to May Day with the emergency distress call of an airline?
Re: The Brief Origins of May Day
#46Why don’t labor issues resonate more with tech workers? I know that we’re not a monolith and are actually a heterogeneous mix of opinions, but there frequently talk about job dissatisfaction (career burnout, comically stingy equity grants, etc). But when organizing comes up, it’s usually treated with disdain because so many have bought into highly individualistic hustle-culture and the narrative that unions only exis…
From a personal perspective -
I don't care that much about "labour issues" because it seems like a logically flawed avenue to explore to begin with.
To be financially successful under any market system I can think of requires you, in a mathematical sense, to be close enough to the top within a company that you get a greater proportion of the profit than simply 1/employees.
In simple terms - I can't employ a maid unless I earn more than a maid, a maid can never be paid enough that I would want to be a maid (being the maid's employer, or at least having that optionality, is strictly superior).
Some jobs have comparative advantage, e.g. I might enjoy working on my car but know that a mechanic can do the same job in 1/10th the time. But a lot of stuff is just straight - I earn more than you, you do it for me, so I can get more things done.
Re: The Brief Origins of May Day
#47Why don’t labor issues resonate more with tech workers? I know that we’re not a monolith and are actually a heterogeneous mix of opinions, but there frequently talk about job dissatisfaction (career burnout, comically stingy equity grants, etc). But when organizing comes up, it’s usually treated with disdain because so many have bought into highly individualistic hustle-culture and the narrative that unions only exis…
The unions I have heard about or seen in action (in Poland or from news) either
(1) demanded flat payment increases for all workers based on seniority etc. Which may make sense for factory workers but I am not enthusiastic about flat rates for programmers not taking into account actual experience/availability/output etc.
Factory workers in many cases do job that can be easily rated and measured and do some specific amount of it.
While measuring output of programmers is notoriously hard.
I expect that union agreement of this kind would in fact benefit only lazy freeloaders not doing any work but having seniority.
(2) are guilds that existed to keep jobs for members and to outlaw or ban hiring outsiders.
I strictly prefer for exclusionary guilds to not exist and one of my big worries is that one would be setup, in area affecting me. One way or another, not necessarily an obvious self-naming itself as a guild.
(3) are gangs existing to steal public money - for example, see coal miners in Poland. Main union achievements was to steal billions of public money to help lazy freeloaders doing work that was not worth doing or outright harmful.
I do not support theft, also in terms of parasiting on public resources. Even if I would get some of proceeds of theft.
(4) intended to achieve more free days, flexibility etc. On my freelancing agreements I sacrificed large part of earning to get about 100+ free days a year, very significant flexibility where and how and on what I work. So this part is achieved for me - and I am not sure how many other tech workers would actually prefer more free time over being paid more.
I am not automatically against unions for tech workers but my first reaction and assumption is not that it will be positive or useful for me.
Re: The Brief Origins of May Day
#48Earlier quoted context omitted.
[flagged]
[flagged]
...with rights for all workers that today it would be unthinkable to even question? Or worse, women's suffrage? Or rights for people of color?
There's no such thing as a (successful) social movement that doesn't employ some amount of violence - the police and the state more generally simply won't allow it.
Re: The Brief Origins of May Day
#49Earlier quoted context omitted.
[flagged]
Please don't comment like this on Hacker News. Please take note of the guidelines, in particular these ones: Be kind. Don't be snarky. Converse curiously; don't cross-examine. Edit out swipes. Comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less, as a topic gets more divisive. Eschew flamebait. Avoid generic tangents. Omit internet tropes. Please don't use Hacker News for political or ideological battle. It…
[flagged]
Re: The Brief Origins of May Day
#50Badass read. Geez we are soft today…
We have been conditioned to fear the idea of demanding a more fair distribution of wealth: My great grandfather for example was shot dead by a cop during a union strike. Nothing happened after that event, just silence, fear and a deeply traumatized family. It is very important to remember that many of the things we enjoy today as workers only exist because of the enormous courage of workers from the 19th and early 20…
And a reminder that the police have never been on the side of the people. They are they muscle of the state.