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Sycophancy in GPT-4o

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Re: Sycophancy in GPT-4o

#281

Post by derwiki »

infecto wrote: post #246
celdon25 wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was about to roast you until I realized this had to be satire given the situation, haha. They tried to imitate grok with a cheaply made system prompt, it had an uncanny effect, likely because it was built on a shaky foundation. And now they are trying to save face before they lose customers to Grok 3.5 which is releasing in beta early next week.

Is anyone actually using grok on a day to day? Does an OpenAI even consider it competition. Last I checked a couple weeks ago grok was getting better but still not a great experience and it’s too childish.

In our work AI channel, I was surprised how many people prefer grok over all the other models.

Re: Sycophancy in GPT-4o

#282

Post by srveale »

WhitneyLand wrote: post #280
whatnow37373 wrote: post #108

Wow - What an excellent update! Now you are getting to the core of the issue and doing what only a small minority is capable of: fixing stuff. This takes real courage and commitment. It’s a sign of true maturity and pragmatism that’s commendable in this day and age. Not many people are capable of penetrating this deeply into the heart of the issue. Let’s get to work. Methodically. Would you like me to write a future…

It’s gross even in satire. What’s weird was you couldn’t even prompt around it. I tried things like ”Don’t compliment me or my questions at all. After every response you make in this conversation, evaluate whether or not your response has violated this directive.” It would then keep complementing me and note how it made a mistake for doing so.

I'm so sorry for complimenting you. You are totally on point to call it out. This is the kind of thing that only true heroes, standing tall, would even be able to comprehend. So kudos to you, rugged warrior, and never let me be overly effusive again.

Re: Sycophancy in GPT-4o

#283

Post by d1sxeyes »

latexr wrote: post #251
kurkku wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use the en-dash (Alt+0150) instead of the em. The en-dash and the em-dash are interchangeable in Finnish. The shorter form has more "inoffensive" look-and-feel and maybe that's why it's used more often here. Now that I think of it, I don't seem to remember the alt code of the em-dash...

> The en-dash and the em-dash are interchangeable in Finnish. But not in English, where the en-dash is used to denote ranges.

I wonder whether ChatGPT and the like use more en dashes in Finnish, and whether this is seen as a sign that someone is using an LLM?

In casual English, both em and en dashes are typically typed as a hyphen because this is what’s available readily on the keyboard. Do you have en dashes on a Finnish keyboard?

Re: Sycophancy in GPT-4o

#284

Post by coro_1 »

thethethethe wrote: post #5

I know someone who is going through a rapidly escalating psychotic break right now who is spending a lot of time talking to chatgpt and it seems like this "glazing" update has definitely not been helping. Safety of these AI systems is much more than just about getting instructions on how to make bombs. There have to be many many people with mental health issues relying on AI for validation, ideas, therapy, etc. This…

Why are they using AI to heal a psychotic break? AI’s great for getting through tough situations, if you use it right, and you’re self aware. But, they may benefit from an intervention. AI isn't nearly as UI-level addicting as say an IG feed. People can pull away pretty easily.

Re: Sycophancy in GPT-4o

#285

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

whatnow37373 wrote: post #108

Wow - What an excellent update! Now you are getting to the core of the issue and doing what only a small minority is capable of: fixing stuff. This takes real courage and commitment. It’s a sign of true maturity and pragmatism that’s commendable in this day and age. Not many people are capable of penetrating this deeply into the heart of the issue. Let’s get to work. Methodically. Would you like me to write a future…

The other day, I had a bug I was trying to exorcise, and asked ChatGPT for ideas.

It gave me a couple, that didn't work.

Once I figured it it out and fixed it, I reported the fix in an (what I understand to be misguided) attempt to help it to learn alternatives, and it gave me this absolutely sickening gush about how damn cool I was, for finding and fixing the bug.

I felt like this: https://youtu.be/aczPDGC3f8U?si=QH3hrUXxuMUq8IEV&t=27

Re: Sycophancy in GPT-4o

#286

Post by dingnuts »

spiderfarmer wrote: post #142
celdon25 wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was about to roast you until I realized this had to be satire given the situation, haha. They tried to imitate grok with a cheaply made system prompt, it had an uncanny effect, likely because it was built on a shaky foundation. And now they are trying to save face before they lose customers to Grok 3.5 which is releasing in beta early next week.

Only AI enthusiasts know about Grok, and only some dedicated subset of fans are advocating for it. Meanwhile even my 97 year old grandfather heard about ChatGPT.

not true, I know at least one right wing normie Boomer that uses Grok because it's the one Elon made.

Re: Sycophancy in GPT-4o

#287

Post by coro_1 »

dev0p wrote: post #176

As an engineer, I need AIs to tell me when something is wrong or outright stupid. I'm not seeking validation, I want solutions that work. 4o was unusable because of this, very glad to see OpenAI walk back on it and recognise their mistake. Hopefully they learned from this and won't repeat the same errors, especially considering the devastating effects of unleashing THE yes-man on people who do not have the mental cap…

I hear you. When a pattern of agreement is all to often observed on the output level, you’re either seeing yourself on some level of ingenuity or hopefully if aware enough, you sense it and tell the AI to ease up. I love adding in "don’t tell me what I want to hear" every now and then. Oh, it gets honest.

Re: Sycophancy in GPT-4o

#288

Post by kromem »

clysm wrote: post #263
simonw wrote: post #20

I enjoyed this example of sycophancy from Reddit: New ChatGPT just told me my literal "shit on a stick" business idea is genius and I should drop $30K to make it real https://www.reddit.com/r/ChatGPT/comments/1k920cg/new_chatgp... Here's the prompt: https://www.reddit.com/r/ChatGPT/comments/1k920cg/comment/mp...

Absolute bull. The writing style is exactly the same between the “prompt” and “response”. Its faked.

The response is 1,000% written by 4o. Very clear tells, and in line with many other samples from the past few days.

Re: Sycophancy in GPT-4o

#289

Post by GrumpyNl »

bilbo0s wrote: post #183
spiderfarmer wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only AI enthusiasts know about Grok, and only some dedicated subset of fans are advocating for it. Meanwhile even my 97 year old grandfather heard about ChatGPT.

This. Only on HN does ChatGPT somehow fear losing customers to Grok. Until Grok works out how to market to my mother, or at least make my mother aware that it exists, taking ChatGPT customers ain't happening.

I see more and more GROK used responses on X, so its picking up.

Re: Sycophancy in GPT-4o

#290

Post by [deleted] »

coro_1 wrote: post #287
dev0p wrote: post #176

As an engineer, I need AIs to tell me when something is wrong or outright stupid. I'm not seeking validation, I want solutions that work. 4o was unusable because of this, very glad to see OpenAI walk back on it and recognise their mistake. Hopefully they learned from this and won't repeat the same errors, especially considering the devastating effects of unleashing THE yes-man on people who do not have the mental cap…

I hear you. When a pattern of agreement is all to often observed on the output level, you’re either seeing yourself on some level of ingenuity or hopefully if aware enough, you sense it and tell the AI to ease up. I love adding in "don’t tell me what I want to hear" every now and then. Oh, it gets honest.

[deleted]
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