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Waymo and Toyota outline partnership to advance autonomous driving deployment

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291–300 of 397 posts

Re: Waymo and Toyota outline partnership to advance autonomous driving deployment

#291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mine drove me from my house to the airport without my ever touching the steering wheel so what exactly do you mean?

Adaptive cruise control could do that too. How impressive it is depends on where you live.

> Adaptive cruise control could do that too.

No, it could not.

Re: Waymo and Toyota outline partnership to advance autonomous driving deployment

#292
post #284
post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m sure that sounded more clever in your head but an actual legal agreement is more than marketing.

No, they really are no different. A legal guarantee doesn't actually mean the car is safe, it means they will pay for it when the safety features fail. Those fees paid out can just be considered a marketing expense to make the car appear safer.

Yes, they are different. The degree depends on the company and if they have a history of trying to weasel out, but a legal agreement makes it harder to dodge liability in court.

Tesla would love to offer the reassurance to buyers but there’s a reason they haven’t done so: they’d lose money on it.

Re: Waymo and Toyota outline partnership to advance autonomous driving deployment

#293
post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use it every day on every street in Vancouver. Where do you come up with your information?

You’re driving. Why you can’t watch a movie like you can on a Mercedes L3 car.

The ODD for drive pilot is so limited, I don’t think it’s really comparable. I have very little faith that their approach will scale to anything more than a traffic jam pilot gimmick.

It’s fair to argue that FSD is limited as well but I believe their approach is much more scalable.

Re: Waymo and Toyota outline partnership to advance autonomous driving deployment

#294
post #277
post #226

The future of (public) transportation absolutely is driverless cars. Every time I'm stuck in traffic on an LA highway with 5+ lanes and I see the horrendously inefficient use of space this future becomes clearer. Waymos are also really confidence inspiring. They drive more safely and cautiously than any Uber/Lyft driver I've ridden with. If every car on the road was synced then they could drive more closely to each o…

> If every car on the road was synced then they could drive more closely to each other and at much faster speeds. This would optimize road space, decrease congestion, and reduce transit times. So like a train?

Like a train without the worst of the public, where any individual can choose their preferred spot for a station.

Re: Waymo and Toyota outline partnership to advance autonomous driving deployment

#295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not everyone wants an EV, especially in America. Unless EV’s can jump to 500 mile range and ubiquitous five minute charging, a lot of people are just gonna want a hybrid.

I want a range extended EV with a easily removable power pack. Unfortunately the EPA doesn't consider it an EV so no one will make one because there's no tax credit.

Plug in hybrids are eligible for the U.S. Federal $7,500 tax credit if they meet the same battery mineral sourcing requirements as the EVs do.

https://fueleconomy.gov/feg/tax2023.shtml

Re: Waymo and Toyota outline partnership to advance autonomous driving deployment

#296
post #226

The future of (public) transportation absolutely is driverless cars. Every time I'm stuck in traffic on an LA highway with 5+ lanes and I see the horrendously inefficient use of space this future becomes clearer. Waymos are also really confidence inspiring. They drive more safely and cautiously than any Uber/Lyft driver I've ridden with. If every car on the road was synced then they could drive more closely to each o…

> If every car on the road was synced then they could drive more closely to each other and at much faster speeds. This would optimize road space, decrease congestion, and reduce transit times. That's not going to happen, not in our lifetimes. It's not safe to do this unless you have a critical mass of cars on the road capable of doing it. Given the average age of cars, it'll take ~10-15 years from such tech being man…

How does it require a critical mass?

If the car ahead of you is sharing visibility and braking data, you can drive on their bumper and stop when they stop.

If the car next to you is receiving route data, they can open a spot for you to get to your exit.

The benefit is large and NOT REQUIRED for normal operation. It's the easiest coordination problem in the world, because it's all upside and practically atomic.

Re: Waymo and Toyota outline partnership to advance autonomous driving deployment

#297
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> have been clear I disagree. They backed hydrogen / fuel cells for most of the years others were developing bevs.

The Hydrogen/fuel-cells were not mass-marketable for some reason, and also beyond that they have been hard to manufacture and sustain, especially when it came to setting up that network of fueling stations and adoptability for customers.

I remember looking at a fueling station years ago, and one kg of hydrogen (~ 1 gal of gas?) was over $17 at the time.

No worries for the folks who got free fuel with their car at first, but didn't seem sustainable (for a wallet).

Re: Waymo and Toyota outline partnership to advance autonomous driving deployment

#298
post #292
post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, they really are no different. A legal guarantee doesn't actually mean the car is safe, it means they will pay for it when the safety features fail. Those fees paid out can just be considered a marketing expense to make the car appear safer.

Yes, they are different. The degree depends on the company and if they have a history of trying to weasel out, but a legal agreement makes it harder to dodge liability in court. Tesla would love to offer the reassurance to buyers but there’s a reason they haven’t done so: they’d lose money on it.

You are failing to understand what I'm saying. They don't have to weasel out of legal liability in court. They just bake the legal settlements they know they will have to pay into their marketing budget.

Has no one watched Fight Club and heard the anecdote about how a company will only recall a car if the cost of the recall is lower than the cost of settling all the lawsuits? All this guarantee tells us is that Mercedes did a similar calculation. Taking legal liability is not proof the car is safe. It is proof that they think the value of customers thinking the car is safe is more valuable than the cost of paying out settlements. Tesla not making the guarantee does not prove their cars are unsafe. It is evidence that if they did the same calculation, that got a different result. Maybe that is because the car is more dangerous, but it could also just be a different marketing philosophy and Tesla notably does not approach marketing like most other car companies.

The conclusion that you reached in which the Mercedes is safer than the Tesla is valuable to Mercedes and that opinion was indirectly purchased by Mercedes paying out legal settlements.

Re: Waymo and Toyota outline partnership to advance autonomous driving deployment

#299
post #134
post #119

Anything Toyota latches themselves to eventually dies. Toyota and hybrid vehicles - very weak entry into the market Toyota and hydrogen powered vehicles - dead on arrival Toyota’s failure to electrify fleet Now they want autonomous vehicles? Wonder who backs out first? Waymo or Toyota once they realize what a joke Toyota is. Well at least they are not collaborating with Nissan.

Best selling company year after year. Hybrids are growing faster than EVs.

This source seems to show that hybrid and EV sales are pretty comparable?

https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=63904

Re: Waymo and Toyota outline partnership to advance autonomous driving deployment

#300
post #142
post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if there are charging stations every ten miles along the exact route you were already planning to take, it’s just straightforwardly true that it’s more annoying to charge vs. get gas. I can fill my tank and be back on the road in With an EV, I would be stopping anywhere from 10-30minutes (depending on the kinds of chargers available) (assuming I don’t have to wait for one to open up), and I’d be doing it twice a…

I think this is overstated. My Ford EV gets ~300 miles. If I leave my home with a full charge, I can get ~500 miles with ~30 minutes of charging. If a ~30 minute break in the middle of an ~8 hour drive is a problem for you, you probably aren't a safe driver. There is a reason that truckers have mandatory breaks. A person shouldn't be driving all day nonstop.

Really? Maybe my knowledge of EV ranges is way out of wack. I was assuming avg ranges look much more like ~200mi on a full battery in real-world conditions, and that a 30-min charge usually only gets you 80%. Sounds like I’m at least somewhat misinformed.
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