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I just want to code (2023)

zachbellay.com

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Re: I just want to code (2023)

#61

Post by stepbeek »

alkonaut wrote: post #59

Do many people hobby code with that entrepreneur mindset thing? Or sit down to play guitar thinking they want to make a hit and feeling bad if they just noodle some cover songs? What a miserable existence that must be. How do you get that way? Should we blame LinkedIn or what is it?

I had my own company previously and I found it hard to detangle that commercial mindset from hobby coding. I’m employed now and find it much easier to code purely for fun.

If I played guitar professionally then I’d probably find it hard to not think about new pieces in the context of a gig-worthy repertoire.

Re: I just want to code (2023)

#62

Post by makeitdouble »

alkonaut wrote: post #59

Do many people hobby code with that entrepreneur mindset thing? Or sit down to play guitar thinking they want to make a hit and feeling bad if they just noodle some cover songs? What a miserable existence that must be. How do you get that way? Should we blame LinkedIn or what is it?

This is a reaction that I had for a time, until realizing that outside of just "some people are different", there is also the wider protestant work ethic putting work at the center of their life, and assigning a moral value to productive work.

I'm describing it in too vague terms to be appropriate, and most people might be thinking it in that way, but I genuinely think there's a part of it in a lot of the "I did this paid service as a weekend project" mentality.

Re: I just want to code (2023)

#64

Post by cess11 »

alkonaut wrote: post #59

Do many people hobby code with that entrepreneur mindset thing? Or sit down to play guitar thinking they want to make a hit and feeling bad if they just noodle some cover songs? What a miserable existence that must be. How do you get that way? Should we blame LinkedIn or what is it?

Many people think that they just have to write some code and execute it publicly and they'll somehow be provided for. That can sully recreational coding since it makes it hard to see that it will most definitely not be directly profitable without a lot of non-coding labour.

Doing business is demanding, you've got compliance and documentation and code needs to be intelligible to other people and finances and marketing and planning and customer support and all that domain knowledge that allows you to catch more than one or two paying customers because your solution works in most of a sector of society and so on.

With this in mind you'll have an easy time seeing that your for fun, recreational project is not a business and that you can't think of it as one until users are starting to force you to by being so many or offering money for additional services.

Re: I just want to code (2023)

#65

Post by necovek »

mncharity wrote: post #23
codr7 wrote: post #5

I've found that just writing code only takes me so far, I need to share as well to feel good about it. But sharing anything outside of the ordinary with the world means painting a pretty big target on your back. On the positive side, it also opens up an avenue for getting paid. My point is that if you start with the fun and let it grow from there, and you're willing to go through the discomfort of sharing, it doesn't…

> share as well to feel good about it. But I wish to share, but not to helicopter parent. I've long felt this case ill served, from 1995 Perl CPAN's "you own the package name" (vs author -packagename-version triples), to 2025 github's impoverished support for communities of forks. No "past me wrote this; present me frees it to jam; future me isn't involved - play well together, and maybe someday I'll listen in or dro…

That's only with GitHub. There are other platforms, obviously less popular, which don't take that approach.

Heck, most of the "real" free software world (the one building entire operating systems, desktop environments, programming languages, games... other than Linus with Linux) operate in that manner.

I am always perplexed when people ask me about my GitHub account for my opensource contributions: I point them at whatever the latest incarnation of ohloh (OpenHub) is where they can find thousands of my commits over hundreds of projects.

Re: I just want to code (2023)

#66

Post by defanor »

> But if I didn't listen to the devil from time to time, I wouldn't stay up to date with the latest technologies, and as a result I wouldn't be able to pay my bills.

It appears to imply that new technologies do not count as fun, which may be the case for the author, but not generally. And there are indeed fewer open vacancies requiring older (decades old) technologies exclusively, with vacancies often including currently-hyped technologies in addition to established ones, which opens more options and potentially leads to a higher salary if one employs those newer or hyped ones, but I guess that it is quite possible to pay the bills while using mostly the older ones, too.

Re: I just want to code (2023)

#67

Post by Juliate »

blahgeek wrote: post #50
IvanK_net wrote: post #45

I have no idea why they mention coding. It is the same in any kind of job. You can bake cakes for fun, make music for fun, write poems, novels, play chess for fun, practice sports, grow potatos ... At a certain stage, you realize that in order to be able to do only that job, you must make someone pay you for it. You must do it in a way (or in a volume) which makes others happy. The fact that it makes you happy is not…

I think it's more common because one doing only coding can get paid reasonably. On the contrary, few people who "bake cakes for fun, make music for fun, write poems, novels, play chess for fun, practice sports, grow potatos" can get paid enough for a living, so that's usually not an option to consider. (Which is the reason that I find us coding people very lucky.)

> only coding can get paid reasonably

If you happen to work for a company that's big enough to pay reasonably. And even that is still a very temporary accident of times.

There was a time with plenty (comparatively to today) of tailors, living very reasonably, because there was a demand, and the means.

Today, you're lucky if you manage to find one that's in your city, and even more if he/she's not too expensive (that is, compared to ready-made stuff).

Re: I just want to code (2023)

#68

Post by ramon156 »

alkonaut wrote: post #59

Do many people hobby code with that entrepreneur mindset thing? Or sit down to play guitar thinking they want to make a hit and feeling bad if they just noodle some cover songs? What a miserable existence that must be. How do you get that way? Should we blame LinkedIn or what is it?

Because having your own product is something that on paper sounds extremely rewarding. If you do it well, the maintenance might be less than the work you put in your actual job.

Some people want to break out of the cycle, and you can't really blame them for it when the economy is hurting working people (ofcourse excluding that writing software is relative to other jobs a cushion job)

Re: I just want to code (2023)

#69

Post by varjag »

Juliate wrote: post #67
blahgeek wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's more common because one doing only coding can get paid reasonably. On the contrary, few people who "bake cakes for fun, make music for fun, write poems, novels, play chess for fun, practice sports, grow potatos" can get paid enough for a living, so that's usually not an option to consider. (Which is the reason that I find us coding people very lucky.)

> only coding can get paid reasonably If you happen to work for a company that's big enough to pay reasonably. And even that is still a very temporary accident of times. There was a time with plenty (comparatively to today) of tailors, living very reasonably, because there was a demand, and the means. Today, you're lucky if you manage to find one that's in your city, and even more if he/she's not too expensive (that…

Come on, coding is universally at a premium compared to other trades. Naturally you wouldn't have a FAANG salary at an outsourcing farm overseas but it'll certainly provide you with comfortable living by local standards.

Re: I just want to code (2023)

#70

Post by soco »

Juliate wrote: post #67
blahgeek wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's more common because one doing only coding can get paid reasonably. On the contrary, few people who "bake cakes for fun, make music for fun, write poems, novels, play chess for fun, practice sports, grow potatos" can get paid enough for a living, so that's usually not an option to consider. (Which is the reason that I find us coding people very lucky.)

> only coding can get paid reasonably If you happen to work for a company that's big enough to pay reasonably. And even that is still a very temporary accident of times. There was a time with plenty (comparatively to today) of tailors, living very reasonably, because there was a demand, and the means. Today, you're lucky if you manage to find one that's in your city, and even more if he/she's not too expensive (that…

Like you almost spelled out, tailors were never competing with ready-made. Clothing used to be expensive, until people (sometimes children) working for pennies were able to send to you across long distances something good enough to wear.
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