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ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

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Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#561

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> this has nothing to do with startups or tech and doesn’t belong here.

The guidelines explicitly say HN is not just for that. It’s right at the top.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

> On-Topic: (…) That includes more than hacking and startups.

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#562

Six months ago I would have endorsed wide-scale deportations, but after seeing the consequences—families swept into jails, plain-clothes officers ambushing people on their way to work or school, and communities living in constant fear—it’s clear that indiscriminate removals are neither practical nor just. This approach diverts resources from pursuing violent offenders, erodes faith in the rule of law, and forces the…

[flagged]

There is no evidence of illegals voting in any significant number at all. GOP voter suppression had a far bigger effect than a minuscule number of illegals trying to vote for whatever reason.

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#563
post #135

From what research I've seen, the phrasing here should be that non-citizens were deported and chose to bring their US citizen children with them. The children themselves were not deported. This in no way excuses any of the other issues like not allowing contact with legal advocates / attorneys.

This is not accurate, though I have found that people who steep in rightwing propaganda tend to repeat these type of talking points. The Rawlsian veil ethic applies here. EDIT: RE - the knee-jerk downvotes. I appreciate that people pointing out authoritarianism can be painful if you are embracing it. Cognitive dissonance is never a fun thing to work through, and having done it a few times I sympathize with the strugg…

I'm not going to downvote you. But Rawls never applies. Rawls is a big scam. At root, it is relativism wrapped up in the august raiment of state-of-nature social contract theory, whatever his protests to the contrary; and the relativism in this case is what "feels right" to him and his fancy neighbors living in Cambridge.

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#564

Six months ago I would have endorsed wide-scale deportations, but after seeing the consequences—families swept into jails, plain-clothes officers ambushing people on their way to work or school, and communities living in constant fear—it’s clear that indiscriminate removals are neither practical nor just. This approach diverts resources from pursuing violent offenders, erodes faith in the rule of law, and forces the…

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[deleted]

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#565
post #432

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've known children of US citizens who were presumed Americans though having been born in a south American country. Government kicked them all out for being personae non grata Americans --children not excepted.

What’s your point? Other countries also engage in lawlessness to remove people they don’t like?

Well, people are acting like it’s uniquely an American thing to do.

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#566

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What’s the conversation? Separating kids from parents or deporting them with parents because we don’t want them to be separate? There is no question about breaking the law by parents. Question is do you let children be with their mothers(who apparently asked to do so) or no. As someone who came legally to Canada and went through thorough screening of 4 years before coming I just don’t get how people are ok with “chea…

Have you seriously not gone through the thought exercise of why some thoughtful + well-informed people would oppose your opinion on the subject? (1) in previous centuries, the US accepted as many immigrants as could arrive “on Ellis Island” and it only took a few weeks. All of the immigration barriers that you overcame were added by American legislators many centuries after my ancestors came to America. I don’t view…

Re point (5), the "gang of eight" bill would've been the de facto process (illegally entering, having children or marrying, attempting to bring family over via chain migration) the de jure one via advertising to the rest of the word that violating US immigration law does not matter. We ended up running an experiment over the course of the last 4 years to see what that looks like and the results are grim.

>There are simply too many people who have strong opinions and yet believe untrue things about American immigration.

You appear to be operating from a different premise than people who are skeptical of past efforts to "reform" immigration law. "Permanent legal mass migration" is not the bargain the country wants to make, and thus far every attempt to "reform" immigration operates from that initial premise.

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#567

Six months ago I would have endorsed wide-scale deportations, but after seeing the consequences—families swept into jails, plain-clothes officers ambushing people on their way to work or school, and communities living in constant fear—it’s clear that indiscriminate removals are neither practical nor just. This approach diverts resources from pursuing violent offenders, erodes faith in the rule of law, and forces the…

[flagged]

> in order to sway voter demographics in their favour

[citation needed]

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#568

Six months ago I would have endorsed wide-scale deportations, but after seeing the consequences—families swept into jails, plain-clothes officers ambushing people on their way to work or school, and communities living in constant fear—it’s clear that indiscriminate removals are neither practical nor just. This approach diverts resources from pursuing violent offenders, erodes faith in the rule of law, and forces the…

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Where are these alleged twelve million newcomers? If they really poured in to tilt elections, we’d see a sudden demographic spike, yet officials keep rounding up students on legal visas and parents who’ve lived here for years—exactly the people the article labels “families who had lived in the United States for years and had deep ties to their communities.” So where are the fresh arrivals this narrative depends on?

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#569

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

There is no evidence of illegals voting in any significant number at all. GOP voter suppression had a far bigger effect than a minuscule number of illegals trying to vote for whatever reason.

They count toward the electoral college in the census. There is some recent analysis that suggests non-citizens give a ~20 seat advantage to 'blue states' in the house and electoral college. I'll see if I can dig up the source.

They don't have to vote to provide an electoral advantage.

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#570
post #565

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What’s your point? Other countries also engage in lawlessness to remove people they don’t like?

Well, people are acting like it’s uniquely an American thing to do.

They are? Where?
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