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ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

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Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#521

Post by kj4211cash »

generalizations wrote: post #240
ivape wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The people that come here legally don't really build anything of significant value when you compare it to entire immigrant communities. Mexicans, Chinese, Indians, Irish, you name it, they build vast amounts of culture and businesses that get integrated into America. Even if you give me 2 million of the smartest legal immigrants, they will pale in comparison to what large immigrant communities offer to the fabric of…

> American right-wing reeks of elitism Common notion, but based in ignorance. I've found that the left wing is more idealistic, but in the sense that they have chosen not to learn from history and rely on immediate emotional values. The right wing sees second order effects and acts on them. Thus, you get the left calling the right heartless/immoral/racist, and the right calling the left idiots.

"Not to learn from history"? We're in the twilight zone now. It's the right wing that is currently enacting tariffs, scapegoating immigrants, pushing for appeasement in Ukraine, etc.

The Republican party traded logic for populism long ago.

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#522

Post by mtVessel »

stefap2 wrote: post #512

Six months ago I would have endorsed wide-scale deportations, but after seeing the consequences—families swept into jails, plain-clothes officers ambushing people on their way to work or school, and communities living in constant fear—it’s clear that indiscriminate removals are neither practical nor just. This approach diverts resources from pursuing violent offenders, erodes faith in the rule of law, and forces the…

Serious question: how did you envision "wide-scale deportations" playing out, prior to these events?

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#523

Post by 1659447091 »

AustinDev wrote: post #332
pessimizer wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the US government seizing the birthright citizen children of undocumented immigrant parents is an extreme position.

What happens is a single parent is sent to prison? The state takes care of the children.

They look for other relatives to take the children first.

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#524

Post by jolmg »

rdtsc wrote: post #478
p_j_w wrote: post #313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> what do you propose as an alternative with a precedent that you think could be agreeable to most people? How about real actual fucking due process? Maybe they can NOT cut off communication when the citizen father tried to provide her with a phone number for legal counsel. Anything else is ghoulish. Keep defending it if you really don’t give a shit about your level of humanity.

> Maybe they can NOT cut off communication when the citizen father tried Is father a US citizen? Based on https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.lawd.21... assuming that's the right case it doesn't seem like he is

Possibly meant "the citizen's father"

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#526

Post by AIPedant »

andsoitis wrote: post #468
AIPedant wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"you don't apply the law" is a really dishonest way of phrasing this, when "hit them with a small financial penalty for the civil immigration violation and fast-track their green cards" is also an option. Illegally immigrating to the US is a civil violation, not a criminal one, and far less of a threat to US safety than going 5mph over the speed limit or running red lights. It is entirely lawful for the executive and…

> Illegally immigrating to the US is a civil violation, not a criminal one It can be both, depending on the situation: • First-time illegal entry into the U.S. (like crossing the border without inspection) is a criminal misdemeanor under federal law (8 U.S.C. § 1325). • Unlawful presence (like overstaying a visa) is usually a civil violation, not criminal. It can lead to deportation but not criminal charges.

I understand this is splitting hairs, but that law applies equally to US citizens. And formally people aren't deported for crossing into the US illegally, they are deported for being there without a valid visa/etc. (Informally there is more leeway for overstaying a work visa, of course.)

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#527

Post by selimthegrim »

mtVessel wrote: post #522
stefap2 wrote: post #512

Six months ago I would have endorsed wide-scale deportations, but after seeing the consequences—families swept into jails, plain-clothes officers ambushing people on their way to work or school, and communities living in constant fear—it’s clear that indiscriminate removals are neither practical nor just. This approach diverts resources from pursuing violent offenders, erodes faith in the rule of law, and forces the…

Serious question: how did you envision "wide-scale deportations" playing out, prior to these events?

I’m sure they thought it was like the Boondocks Catcher Freeman master’s version of slavery where they were all in the fields playing games and hanging out with pre-packed picnic baskets, waiting for the expedition

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#528

Post by chrisulloa »

mtVessel wrote: post #522
stefap2 wrote: post #512

Six months ago I would have endorsed wide-scale deportations, but after seeing the consequences—families swept into jails, plain-clothes officers ambushing people on their way to work or school, and communities living in constant fear—it’s clear that indiscriminate removals are neither practical nor just. This approach diverts resources from pursuing violent offenders, erodes faith in the rule of law, and forces the…

Serious question: how did you envision "wide-scale deportations" playing out, prior to these events?

seriously can't believe anyone thought it would happen any other way

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#529

Post by vkou »

freen wrote: post #431
queenkjuul wrote: post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People here really seem to like ignoring that part for some reason. That is a very real line that had not previously been crossed.

Especially the part about “we imprisoned legal residents of the US in a foreign country without due process and now can’t do anything about it, even though the Supreme Court told us we have to return them to the USA, because, whoops, they are imprisoned in a foreign country!” bit.

Can't do anything to bring them back, yet keep sending more people there.

Here's a riddle for everyone. What do you call a prison where people go in without trial, never come out, and there's always room for more?

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#530

Post by foxglacier »

pyuser583 wrote: post #501
intermerda wrote: post #460

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The distrust of the press has been cultivated intentionally. A POTUS saying "What you're seeing and what you're reading is not what's happening" would have been seen too farcical for a comedy. And yet here we are.

When you read article after article that imply one thing, but actually say something else, how should we respond? Parsing out what the article says is necessary. It’s how articles are written, and how reporters and editors ask they be read. “John Doe committed a terrible crime, the FBI said” does not mean the press is reporting the John Doe committed a terrible crime. I wish the press would respond to cultivated mist…

Absolutely. And this whole idea of demonizing misinformation just makes it worse by implying that true information presented in a way that intentionally and actually misleads readers is somehow OK.
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