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ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

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Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#361

Post by koolba »

blinky81 wrote: post #354

I cannot for the life of me understand why Americans have such a problem with other people coming here to seek a better life. Half this country has been tricked into seeing hardworking immigrants as a threat to their safety and livelihood — but by all metrics, immigrants are a net positive to society. I also take issue with the idea that this extreme exclusionary mindset is somehow new to America. A lot of people fra…

> I cannot for the life of me understand why Americans have such a problem with other people coming here to seek a better life. Half this country has been tricked into seeing hardworking immigrants as a threat to their safety and livelihood — but by all metrics, immigrants are a net positive to society.

I have no issue with legal immigration. Far from it, I’m in favor of attracting the best, brightest, and most hard working.

But knowing people overseas that want to come to the USA but are respectful enough to want to do it legally, I take issue with anyone that enters the country illegally. They’re cheating the system and showing immediate disdain for our system of laws. The second order effects of funneling money to smugglers and coyotes are bad as well.

Every country has a right to decide who can visit or immigrate. That’s the right of any sovereign state.

If the people of America want more immigration then have them petition their representatives to change the laws to all for it.

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#362

Post by andrepd »

ashoeafoot wrote: post #180
afavour wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Difficult to describe them as choosing to do anything: > ICE held the families incommunicado, refusing or failing to respond to multiple attempts by attorneys and family members to contact them. In one instance, a mother was granted less than one minute on the phone before the call was abruptly terminated when her spouse tried to provide legal counsel’s phone number. What would they do, leave their child in an ICE fa…

[flagged]

Jesus christ hn

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#363

Post by madcadmium »

blinky81 wrote: post #354

I cannot for the life of me understand why Americans have such a problem with other people coming here to seek a better life. Half this country has been tricked into seeing hardworking immigrants as a threat to their safety and livelihood — but by all metrics, immigrants are a net positive to society. I also take issue with the idea that this extreme exclusionary mindset is somehow new to America. A lot of people fra…

> by all metrics, immigrants are a net positive to society.

What about wage suppression?

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#364

Post by stackskipton »

ohgr wrote: post #3
clusterfook wrote: post #2

> But for interesting HN discussion... anyone got any juice on why this is happening. Is there orders going down the chain of command from the president to do this sort of thing. Was this behaviour always there but less reported before? Are they more emboldened by the current environment?

As my wise but now throughly dead German grandmother said: ”Do you think the nazis appeared out of thin air? No they were everywhere just waiting for someone to enable them with a label and an ideology.” I suspect something analogous is happening here and it’s similarly not pretty. Hopefully it’ll get nipped in the bud quickly. My fellow citizens scare me more than the government does.

Since we are quoting, I quote FDR: "Democracy has disappeared in several other great nations--not because the people of those nations disliked democracy, but because they had grown tired of unemployment and insecurity, of seeing their children hungry while they sat helpless in the face of government confusion and government weakness through lack of leadership in government."

True, we are not in bad shape like 1930s Germany or United States but as neoliberalism rot has really set in, people feel economically shaky, and government clearly is not responsive to them. Combined with Social Media warping people brain on what is "success" and "strong man" who will take care of things is clearly appealing. Many of them can also be turned around but it's going to take some doing.

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#365

Post by gradus_ad »

djoldman wrote: post #56

From what research I've seen, the phrasing here should be that non-citizens were deported and chose to bring their US citizen children with them. The children themselves were not deported. This in no way excuses any of the other issues like not allowing contact with legal advocates / attorneys.

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Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#366

Post by queenkjuul »

UmGuys wrote: post #331
potato3732842 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it's always been happening. If they didn't already have this sort of abuse practiced they wouldn't be so good at it. The ACLU used to write basically the same exact pieces about the DEA Maybe it's 10% or 20% more prevalent or worse, I can't say from my vantage point, but it's a difference of degree, not a categorical one. You read these stories and they read exactly like all the other stories of how all sorts…

It has not. We have never previously sent immigrants to foreign concentration camps. There were internment camps which were bad enough during the war, but we're now kidnapping people, sending them to El Salvador, and locking them up for life.

People here really seem to like ignoring that part for some reason. That is a very real line that had not previously been crossed.

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#367

Post by ExoticPearTree »

blinky81 wrote: post #354

I cannot for the life of me understand why Americans have such a problem with other people coming here to seek a better life. Half this country has been tricked into seeing hardworking immigrants as a threat to their safety and livelihood — but by all metrics, immigrants are a net positive to society. I also take issue with the idea that this extreme exclusionary mindset is somehow new to America. A lot of people fra…

> I cannot for the life of me understand why Americans have such a problem with other people coming here to seek a better life.

They do not come legally. That's the problem. Plain and simple.

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#368

Post by generalizations »

nharada wrote: post #314

Feels like this conversation is full of people getting hung up on arguing the technicalities and exact phrasing of this situation. Is that really important to the broader conversation?

Either the technicalities matter, or our legal system runs on vibes. I think it is important.

Re: ICE Deports 3 U.S. Citizen Children Held Incommunicado Prior to the Deportation

#369

Post by masklinn »

pge wrote: post #93
clusterfook wrote: post #2

> But for interesting HN discussion... anyone got any juice on why this is happening. Is there orders going down the chain of command from the president to do this sort of thing. Was this behaviour always there but less reported before? Are they more emboldened by the current environment?

The current administration has set targets for numbers of people deported(which ICE is currently behind on). That creates an incentive to skip due process in order to get more people deported more quickly (and the awareness that there will no consequences for doing so probably contributes as well)

The administration has also been "defending" their absence of due process and trying to work around judge orders to stop, shaving as close to the letter of judicial orders as they could when they don't just ignore them entirely.

ICE taking that as carte blanche to smash and grab is perfectly logical given that agency is ICE.

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