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Your phone isn't secretly listening to you, but the truth is more disturbing

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Re: Your phone isn't secretly listening to you, but the truth is more disturbing

#101

Post by mindcrash »

monkeyfun wrote: post #97
mindcrash wrote: post #85

Way back then I exposed massive data collection from Twitter by Google which made it possible to plot locations at which you used Twitter in Google Maps by simply putting your Twitter handle into the search field. Somehow they knew about these locations even when you opted out of sharing location data with Twitter (I checked) -- so this was only possible by Twitter privately providing this information to Google. This…

Could you link to some of it? Sounds extremely interesting!

See screenshot: https://xcancel.com/kpcuk/status/601451439215353857

Do note that at first it was assumed just Chrome was involved, but then people started to message me that they also saw it when using the apps, Firefox, Safari and other browsers aswell.

Re: Your phone isn't secretly listening to you, but the truth is more disturbing

#102

Post by Argonaut998 »

anenefan wrote: post #5

My younger bro is convinced phones are eavesdropping on conversations and got particularly paranoid (I thought) a year or so back in regard to talking in earshot of his phone. His evidence is empirical - Apparently he gets pretty high with friends and shit talks - but when when the search started to suggest some pretty way out things along the same lines, he landed that their conversations weren't private any more. S…

This matches up with my exact thoughts too. My old phone was an Android, and it was quite old in that the manufacturer hadn't updated it in a while. There were times when speaking about something would give me ads relating to it on Google, or posts in Instagram's case.

Then I got an iPhone and it stopped completely. My wife has a newer Android phone and the same things happen to her.

Now, I swear I read a few years ago that Facebook have teams to deliberately look for vulnerabilities to exploit, as well as things such as this: https://x.com/ashk4n/status/1070349123516170240.

So my personal conclusion(s) is this: 1. There are vulnerabilities in older (if not current) Android versions which companies like Meta exploit to eavesdrop at all times, or at least while the app is not closed. 2. Most people just provide the 'While using the App' or 'Always allow' permissions for the microphone/camera, so this basically gives permission for them to do that regardless, even if it's not what those permissions were requested for (sending a voice message, taking a picture to post etc), BUT now there are status lights for when apps are using the microphone/camera which I never noticed been activated on my wife's phone when using it, unless for the correct reasons.

Between all the apps people use daily which is pretty much Instagram/Twitter/TikTok/WhatsApp, microphone permissions tend to be enabled, and if they are, then most of someone's screen time is on an app with those permissions. Not to mention the 'Google' app on Android phones which seems to have every single permission enabled at all times that perpetually runs.

Sorry, but I'm not buying the "someone else in your home searched something similar" or "ads are so advanced that they can predict what you want" etc excuses. I'm extremely careful with what I search. I have never experienced this once I switched to an iPhone, but I have experienced it too many times when on Android.

Re: Your phone isn't secretly listening to you, but the truth is more disturbing

#104

Post by EasyMark »

microflash wrote: post #40
wrs wrote: post #4

BTW, "smart" TVs send screenshots too. [0] [0] https://dl.acm.org/doi/10.1145/3646547.3689013

We’ve reached the state where you can safely presume anything “smart” is violating your privacy.

yeah, I liked the simplicity of having things on my tv, but I gave up and got an apple tv box. I was getting way too many "I was just talking about that!" ads on some of the "free" services i was watching old tv shows and movies on. I'm a pretty frugal guy for the most part but buying a separate box that doesn't sell everything you do and say to advertisers is worth it.

Re: Your phone isn't secretly listening to you, but the truth is more disturbing

#105

Post by intended »

What rot.

Here’s a simple experiment I ran and still works.

Back in the day there was a truly ghastly add for ear wax removal that showed up on YouTube in the UK.

In an experiment, and prank, I told two of my close friends about this, and how this horrid advert would kill my appetite when it came up.

And then I made it a point to repeat “ear wax removal” loudly several times.

Sure enough. A day later my dear friend messaged me with something on the lines of “I hate you”

Their phones were Android and iOS. I believe it was the Android user suffered.

Re: Your phone isn't secretly listening to you, but the truth is more disturbing

#106

Post by Supermancho »

simonw wrote: post #57
Supermancho wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Chrome Browser can transcribe audio into text, with what I consider good accuracy. It's well out of the realm of a conspiracy theory when it's been demonstrable for a couple decades.

Don't forget energy usage. The phone would need to be on high power mode all the time to run those kinds of algorithms. There's a reason "Hey Siri" has dedicated low-power hardware - it means it can work without burning through the battery.

> it can work without burning through the battery.

It can work by burning through the battery. When you have a browser open or any number of apps, some of them are certainly detecting.

Re: Your phone isn't secretly listening to you, but the truth is more disturbing

#107

Post by blurbleblurble »

The phone is listening. Services like Shazam and Alphonso are constantly fingerprinting audio from the mics and sending these fingerprints up for "matching".

What are they matching against? Against key "content".

To check if the fingerprints from your phone mic match the "content" they have to do some kind of nearest neighbor search. What if the fingerprints aren't super close but they're somewhat close? To "content" related to certain products? Should we send the ad?

What if employees at Alphonso and Shazam _know_ that the fingerprints from your phone aren't quite close enough to have been generated from key monetizable samples of the "content", but also know that they are close enough to be effective? At targeting potential buyers?

Who decides how close is close enough? What's the ethical threshold here? And what's the most profitable threshold?

Re: Your phone isn't secretly listening to you, but the truth is more disturbing

#108

Post by paulcole »

intended wrote: post #105

What rot. Here’s a simple experiment I ran and still works. Back in the day there was a truly ghastly add for ear wax removal that showed up on YouTube in the UK. In an experiment, and prank, I told two of my close friends about this, and how this horrid advert would kill my appetite when it came up. And then I made it a point to repeat “ear wax removal” loudly several times. Sure enough. A day later my dear friend m…

This is why “my phone is listening and I can prove it” is such a good shibboleth for lack of critical thinking skills.

Can you not see all the biases and fallacies in your own comment?

Re: Your phone isn't secretly listening to you, but the truth is more disturbing

#109

Post by udev4096 »

> User permissions for a large number of apps were all enabled

This says it all. Privacy is not by default, because of souless mega corporations, including HN which has an extremely invasive privacy policy. If you don't actively take steps to improve your privacy, they will continue to exploit it. Use GrapheneOS, it is the most private and secure mobile operating system. Nothing happens without your explicit permission, the way it should have been from the beginning

Re: Your phone isn't secretly listening to you, but the truth is more disturbing

#110

Post by titaphraz »

Pretty much every time I add a new contact to my phone I start to get really strange ads online. I figured it out when I added a guy who's retiring for the army. I started getting retirement ads for soldiers.

Then, I add a guy I loosely know and what do I start seeing? Cocaine rehab ads. I shit you not. It's not hard to argue that this is more than a minor privacy violation.

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