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Plagiarism of my open source app ChatSecure

chatsecure.org

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Re: Plagiarism of my open source app ChatSecure

#61

Post by microtonal »

p4bl0 wrote: post #47
bermanoid wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And what part of that is incompatible with a BSD license?

I think (and actually, I hope too) that this isn't: "You cannot distribute Source Code". The BSD license may not force you to redistribute the source code, but I don't see it allowing you to forbid such a thing. Am I wrong? EDIT: It seems I am, since if there was any changes to the product, it can be freely relicensed. The safest way to protect against this is to use a better free software license which is copyleft (…

There is nothing in the BSD license that doesn't allow you to add additional restriction with respect to distribution. IANAL, but there are still two manners in which there could be a violation:

- The BSD license requires one to preserve the copyright notices and the BSD license. If that person stripped these from the software, he would be in violation of the BSD license.

- If the seller did not add anything that is copyrightable, I guess it's questionable if his added terms hold up. In this case it is exactly the same as the original BSD-licensed product, and covered by the BSD license.

What usually happens is that some proprietary software vendor takes a chunk of BSD-licensed software (say, a TCP/IP stack) and integrates it into their proprietary software (say, a kernel). In that case, you'd theoretically be allowed to pry out the BSD-licensed parts and redistribute it. In practice, this will be impossible, since the original source files are probably changed to such an extend that it's a mixture of BSD-licensed and proprietary software.

~~~

Of course, this is all the effect of choosing a weak copyleft license. You are practically saying 'you can do whatever you want with this code, as long as you list my name and this license in the source code and/or binary versions, and don't sue my if it doesn't work correctly'. If you want stronger protection, you should use a strong copyleft or a proprietary license.

Re: Plagiarism of my open source app ChatSecure

#62

Post by microtonal »

intui wrote: post #57
bermanoid wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And what part of that is incompatible with a BSD license?

The license was not reproduced. Please read the BSD license.

Maybe you should too. The BSD license only requires reproduction of the copyright and license terms in (1) the source code; or (2) in the documentation and/or other materials provided with the a binary distribution.

You don't have to state the use of (revised) BSD-licensed code outside the source or binary distribution.

Re: Plagiarism of my open source app ChatSecure

#63

Post by ZoFreX »

intui wrote: post #57
bermanoid wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And what part of that is incompatible with a BSD license?

The license was not reproduced. Please read the BSD license.

Wasn't it? So far no one on HN has paid for the download to see if the copyright notice was preserved or not.

Re: Plagiarism of my open source app ChatSecure

#64

Post by jasonkester »

statictype wrote: post #60
jasonkester wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amazingly, this (and the root comment up top) are actually getting downvoted. I hadn't realized the sentiment among open source developers against making money from their craft was so strong. But it shouldn't be. We, as developers, shouldn't harbor any ill will toward the OP should he decide to pull the open source version and sell it for profit. We certainly shouldn't advise him against it or recommend an alternativ…

I know you (probably) mean well but you're missing the point and come off as fairly condescending. Did you consider the possibility that the author already has a job that pays him extremely well and that the ROI he gets in spending time providing customer support/marketing for a commercial iOS app is actually losing money for him? You should save the "you are allowed to make money" talk for people who are actually tr…

Did you consider the possibility that the author already has a job that pays him extremely well and that the ROI he gets in spending time providing customer support/marketing for a commercial iOS app is actually losing money for him?

I think that's more a rationalization that developers use to convince themselves not to charge for their stuff than a reality. I've certainly never experienced any support/marketing overload with any of my products.

He already has the app in the app store. His support/marketing is where it is already. All he need do is tick a box marked "allow people to send me money" in his app store control panel and he's done. In short, there's no "down" for the app to go. It's already maxed out on the "losing money" front, and doesn't seem to be overburdening him.

On the customer support side, he might actually see that go down too by charging. Here's yesterday's discussion on exactly that:

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4376126

This really is a case where there's no downside to charging money. And, seemingly, a very real downside of keeping it open source.

Re: Plagiarism of my open source app ChatSecure

#65

Post by chrisballinger »

chrisdone wrote: post #45

“I realize the BSD allows people to sell my binaries and source but I do not believe it authorizes them to sell the source under a different license.” Er, that's the exact point of the BSD license. The GPL even allows selling binaries and source code, but not re-licensing. So the gist of this blog post is that you offered your source code under a license that allows re-licensing provided that your copyright and some…

I don't have the cash to buy a "license" to my own code, but I would imagine he removed the copyright notices like he did for Matt Gemmell: https://twitter.com/mattgemmell/status/235302914258792448

I didn't have a problem with him selling my stuff, I just have a problem with him claiming something I wrote as his own.

By the way, Chupamobile responded and removed his software: https://chatsecure.org/blog#7

Re: Plagiarism of my open source app ChatSecure

#66

Post by chrisballinger »

statictype wrote: post #58
jasonkester wrote: post #34

I think you're missing an important lesson here: Your product is more valuable than you think. This guy wouldn't have started selling your thing is it wasn't clear that it's something that people will pay for. Your first reaction when you hear that he's making money off of it shouldn't be how to stop him. It should be "Wow. I could be making money off of this. My advice: - Don't worry about this guy. - Put a price on…

You're assuming he cares at all about making money from this app and the only reason he didn't try is because he didn't know it was possible. His app is free and source code is published on github. Maybe he wants it that way.

From my site:

"This project is 100% free because it is important that all people around the world have unrestricted access to privacy tools. However, developing and supporting this project is hard work and costs real money. Please help support the development of this project!"

:)

Re: Plagiarism of my open source app ChatSecure

#67

Post by microtonal »

shared4you wrote: post #49
chrisballinger wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are relicensing my software: Regular License - $13.99 The regular license allows the use of the purchased item in a project for either personal or commercial uses, without the payment of any further fees or charges after the initial download cost. The regular license gives you the right to use the purchased items within 1 project of your own or on behalf of a client (commercial, personal, or non-profit). You or…

If he has modified even a single line of your source code, he is free to re-license the entire product as a whole under his own license. As long as your name / copyright notice is preserved in the source code / binary, there is nothing illegal about this. How else do you think GPL projects incorporate BSD-code ?

If he has modified even a single line of your source code, he is free to re-license the entire product as a whole under his own license.

Actually, that's not true. In many legislations a minimum amount of originality is required copyright to apply.

Re: Plagiarism of my open source app ChatSecure

#68

Post by forgottenpaswrd »

Well, someone could use your code if it is BSD and charge as much as he wants.

He could use your code with the only requirement to add you to the credits. He also could modify the license, provided that he respects the due credit.

You can't say: "Now my code is GPL!!", the code that this person is using continues being BSD. You gave it away, your DMCA complaint is invalid.

Stop whining and learn about the basics of licensing first. Then focus on your product and not on what other people do. You could also charge for it while giving your code.

Re: Plagiarism of my open source app ChatSecure

#69

Post by osener »

jasonkester wrote: post #34

I think you're missing an important lesson here: Your product is more valuable than you think. This guy wouldn't have started selling your thing is it wasn't clear that it's something that people will pay for. Your first reaction when you hear that he's making money off of it shouldn't be how to stop him. It should be "Wow. I could be making money off of this. My advice: - Don't worry about this guy. - Put a price on…

> Stop giving away the source

> There's no rule saying that you have to give your work away as open source.

This is insulting to the author and the whole open source community. You seem to think that people release sources of their software because they think it is worthless or don't know they could make the conscious choice not to release the sources.

Releasing your source code involves a lot more reasoning and motivation than not doing it. Building open source software doesn't mean giving your work away for free, nothing keeps the author from selling his open source application on App Store as a convenience (an example of this practice is Growl). Since we are talking about a mobile application, it is especially easier to sell since most of his users won't even consider building it from source.

Re: Plagiarism of my open source app ChatSecure

#70

Post by chrisballinger »

forgottenpaswrd wrote: post #68

Well, someone could use your code if it is BSD and charge as much as he wants. He could use your code with the only requirement to add you to the credits. He also could modify the license, provided that he respects the due credit. You can't say: "Now my code is GPL!!", the code that this person is using continues being BSD. You gave it away, your DMCA complaint is invalid. Stop whining and learn about the basics of l…

Yeah, apparently he removed the copyright notices, violating the BSD: https://twitter.com/mattgemmell/status/235302914258792448

To help prevent any future problems I have changed the license to GPL.

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