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An update to our pricing

windsurf.com

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Re: An update to our pricing

#21

Post by Alifatisk »

Workaccount2 wrote: post #18
rudedogg wrote: post #6

> To train, develop, and improve the artificial intelligence, machine learning, and models that we use to support our Services. We may use your Log and Usage Information and Prompts and Outputs Information for this purpose. https://windsurf.com/privacy-policy Am I the only one bothered by this? Same with Gemini Advanced (paid) training on your prompts. It feels like I’m paying with money, but also handing over my ent…

Gemini doesn't use paid API prompts for training.[1] I believe its just for free usage and the web app. [1] https://ai.google.dev/gemini-api/docs/pricing

That's what I thought

Re: An update to our pricing

#22

Post by amelius »

rudedogg wrote: post #6

> To train, develop, and improve the artificial intelligence, machine learning, and models that we use to support our Services. We may use your Log and Usage Information and Prompts and Outputs Information for this purpose. https://windsurf.com/privacy-policy Am I the only one bothered by this? Same with Gemini Advanced (paid) training on your prompts. It feels like I’m paying with money, but also handing over my ent…

Windsurf: where the users provide the wind and they do all the surfing.

Re: An update to our pricing

#24

Post by ariejan »

braza wrote: post #14

Honest question: what does it mean this new pricing that every product has today in terms of “credits”. Sounds quite apache given the fact that you will need to track utilisation all the time for something like prompting. Does someone has any insight on why the old flat pricing or utilisation prices are not in those new AI products where we have this abstract concept as credit?

With Windsurf I'm able to pick any of the premium language models. I.e. Claude 3.7 Sonnet costs 1 credit / prompt, whereas the thinking model costs 1.25 credits, and o3 costs a whopping 7.5 credits.

It's simply passing on the cost of respective model's costs, I think. I can image it's hard to come up with an affordable / interesting flat rate _and_ support all those differently priced models.

Re: An update to our pricing

#25

Post by rohanphadte »

elashri wrote: post #11

I was a user on one of their pro plans with some discount. I remember getting confused between the two tokens limits (flow action and the other one). I am puzzled now trying to figure out if the change corresponds to effective decrease or increase of the pricing. They eliminated the flow action now. To be honest I think it might be that I couldn't understand the change. The only thing I notice is that for 250 additio…

The previous two token limits were: user prompt credits (500) flow actions credits (1500)

For power users, flow actions would deplete much more quickly (every time the LLM analyzed a file, edited, etc), so Windsurf removed the flow action limit, so you're only getting charged for 500 messages to the AI, which is strictly better for the user.

Re: An update to our pricing

#26

Post by rudedogg »

Workaccount2 wrote: post #18
rudedogg wrote: post #6

> To train, develop, and improve the artificial intelligence, machine learning, and models that we use to support our Services. We may use your Log and Usage Information and Prompts and Outputs Information for this purpose. https://windsurf.com/privacy-policy Am I the only one bothered by this? Same with Gemini Advanced (paid) training on your prompts. It feels like I’m paying with money, but also handing over my ent…

Gemini doesn't use paid API prompts for training.[1] I believe its just for free usage and the web app. [1] https://ai.google.dev/gemini-api/docs/pricing

Yeah, I was referring to their webapp/Chat, aka Gemini Advanced. It uses your prompts for training unless you turn off chat history completely, or are in their “Workspace” enterprise version.

https://support.google.com/gemini/answer/13594961?hl=en

> What data is collected and how it’s used

> Google collects your chats (including recordings of your Gemini Live interactions), what you share with Gemini Apps (like files, images, and screens), related product usage information, your feedback, and info about your location. Info about your location includes the general area from your device, IP address, or Home or Work addresses in your Google Account. Learn more about location data at g.co/privacypolicy/location.

Google uses this data, consistent with our Privacy Policy, to provide, improve, and develop Google products and services and machine-learning technologies, including Google’s enterprise products such as Google Cloud.

Gemini Apps Activity is on by default if you are 18 or older. Users under 18 can choose to turn it on. If your Gemini Apps Activity setting is on, Google stores your Gemini Apps activity with your Google Account for up to 18 months. You can change this to 3 or 36 months in your Gemini Apps Activity setting.

Re: An update to our pricing

#27

Post by kmeisthax »

rudedogg wrote: post #6

> To train, develop, and improve the artificial intelligence, machine learning, and models that we use to support our Services. We may use your Log and Usage Information and Prompts and Outputs Information for this purpose. https://windsurf.com/privacy-policy Am I the only one bothered by this? Same with Gemini Advanced (paid) training on your prompts. It feels like I’m paying with money, but also handing over my ent…

Without exception, every AI company is a play for your data. AI requires a continuing supply of new data to train on, it does not "get better" merely by using the existing trainsets with more compute.

Furthermore, synthetic data is a flawed concept. At a minimum, it tends to propagate and amplify biases in the model generating the data. If you ignore that, there's also the fundamental issue that data doesn't exist purely to run more gradient descent, but to provide new information that isn't already compressed into the existing model. Providing additional copies of the same information cannot help.

Re: An update to our pricing

#28

Post by kmeisthax »

Solely from reading the headline, I'm going to assume "update" means "price increase". I'm going to read the rest of the article before continuing the comment.

Alright, I'm back, this sounds like one of the rare times in which a pricing "update" is actually an update and not just a disguised increase. But I'm also not a Windsurf user, so let me jump through some of the comments and double-check that I didn't get hoodwinked.

...and the comments seem pretty positive, at least regarding the pricing. So I think this is actually one of those few times "update" means "update".

Re: An update to our pricing

#29

Post by leobuskin »

Jcampuzano2 wrote: post #15
jawns wrote: post #2

As an avid Windsurf user, I support this simplification of the pricing. In nearly all cases, I don't care how many individual steps the model needs to take to accomplish the task. I just want it to do what I've asked it to do. It is curious, however, that this move is coinciding with rumors of OpenAI attempting to acquire Windsurf. If an acquisition were imminent, it would seem strange to mess with the pricing struct…

Curious - what makes you pick, windsurf over other editors. I currently use Cursor but have seen more news about windsurf, especially after the recent news with respect to OpenAI. Do you find it better, worse, etc. And are there things it does better for you than other editors.

I don't like the "vibe" term nowadays, but when you mix two pretty abstract domains (AI and development), it's all about vibes and aura. Some model/agent works perfectly for one of us (let's keep in mind, we have a bunch of factors, from language to the complexity of the implementation), and does everything wrong for others.

You just can't measure it properly, outside of experiments and building your own assessment within your context. All the recommendations here just don't work. "Try all of them, stick with one for a while, don't forget to retry others on a regular basis" - that's my moto today.

Cursor (as an agent/orchestrator) didn't work for me at all (Python, low-level, no frameworks, not webdev). I fell in love with Windsurf ($60 tier initially). Switched entirely to JetBrains AI a few days ago (vscode is not friendly for me, PyCharm rocks), so happy about the price drop.

Re: An update to our pricing

#30

Post by parliament32 »

rudedogg wrote: post #6

> To train, develop, and improve the artificial intelligence, machine learning, and models that we use to support our Services. We may use your Log and Usage Information and Prompts and Outputs Information for this purpose. https://windsurf.com/privacy-policy Am I the only one bothered by this? Same with Gemini Advanced (paid) training on your prompts. It feels like I’m paying with money, but also handing over my ent…

> Same with Gemini Advanced (paid) training on your prompts

I'm not sure if this is true.

> 17. Training Restriction. Google will not use Customer Data to train or fine-tune any AI/ML models without Customer's prior permission or instruction.

https://cloud.google.com/terms/service-terms

> This Generative AI for Google Workspace Privacy Hub covers... the Gemini app on web (i.e. gemini.google.com) and mobile (Android and iOS).

> Your content is not used for any other customers. Your content is not human reviewed or used for Generative AI model training outside your domain without permission.

> The prompts that a user enters when interacting with features available in Gemini are not used beyond the context of the user trust boundary. Prompt content is not used for training generative AI models outside of your domain without your permission.

> Does Google use my data (including prompts) to train generative AI models? No. User prompts are considered customer data under the Cloud Data Processing Addendum.

https://support.google.com/a/answer/15706919

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