If a big tech company shows any interest in your open source project, don't ever assume there are any good intentions. Never agree to any meeting or unpaid work, or do any work or go out of your way for them unless you have a contract. Be extra careful when dealing with a big company, because they have a lot of resources and do not care about you or your project.
Getting forked by Microsoft
671–680 of 1001 posts
Re: Getting forked by Microsoft
#672Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, charity. That's exactly what these trillion dollar empires think of those open source maintainers. Microsoft pulled this same stunt multiple times on os maintainers.
Open source has been hijacked by trillion dollar hyperscalers. It's time we switch to "fair source" or "equitable source". Put MAU/DAU/ARR/market cap limits in your license. Open to everyone with a market cap under $1B or revenues under $100M. All others, please see our "business@" email. Place viral terms like the AGPL that requires that all other systems touched by your code to be open - especially the backend/serv…
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Re: Getting forked by Microsoft
#673Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's also very possible they had been working on it already and wanted to compare notes, I certainly would if I were working on something internal and found a similar project, but I agree, ask them for a consultation fee. I don't see why they wouldn't pay it. Both projects also share in license, so I have less of an issue with it personally. They're both MIT licensed.
> I don't see why they wouldn't pay it. Oh I do. The person that wanted to setup the meeting likely has no budget control. Big corps like to keep the ability to pay for stuff out of the hands of individuals and isolated in bureaucratic nightmares. You'd be more than reasonable to demand "$1000/hr with 1 hour minimum" for such a consulting and I'd see HR in MS doing an immediate "hell no" to that.
> Big corps like to keep the ability to pay for stuff out of the hands of individuals and isolated in bureaucratic nightmares
I'd say my experience is exactly the contrary. Middle managers in my experience in mega corps have a lot of expense latitude for these kinds of things, expedited approvals, corporate credit cards. At least in the finance and tech world.
Re: Getting forked by Microsoft
#674There is a very long storied history of Microsoft being an extremely scummy anticompetitive company...
Re: Getting forked by Microsoft
#675> I default to using the MIT license as it is simple and permissive What's good about being "permissive"? I keep hearing this argument, but I still don't understand, what's the incentive for authors of one-man projects to choose anything "permissive". Do you enjoy your project getting forked, walled off and exploited for profit by someone who has never done you any good? AGPLv3 still allows forking, still allows maki…
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Re: Getting forked by Microsoft
#676Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I keep hearing this argument, but I still don't understand, what's the incentive for authors of one-man projects to choose anything "permissive". My JS canvas library is licensed using MIT. From my personal perspective, I wouldn't have any problem with some $MegaCorp coming along and forking it, and even claiming it as their own creation. But ... why? Because one of the main drivers for my development of the librar…
Remember EEE. Very likely, you'll end up with a $MegaCorp-backed competitor driven by goals very different from yours.
EEE assumes open source software is only going to be created if it is widely used. As soon as that isn't true, it is irrelevant.
It was effective against companies that relied on interoperability and profited when people used their software projects. On the other hand, if someone wants to add features that my project can't support, it changes nothing about my life or work.
When the goal is "make the best software possible", the $MegaCorp would only compete by making software that is better that what is available in the open source ecosystem. That doesn't take anything away from anyone else. It is a Pareto improvement: people can pay and have even better software, or not pay and use the still-good free option.
Re: Getting forked by Microsoft
#677Getting 'forked' (so to speak) by Microsoft was the norm, and might again be.
Up until the dotcom boom (and in the earlier days of it), one of the questions I'd heard of software startups was something like, "What will you do when Microsoft decides to own your space?"
Fortunately, the broad tech industry overall got a decade or two reprieve from that, though it might be starting to return.
A long related question, when partnering with Microsoft, which sounds like it still applies, is "What's your plan for when Microsoft stabs you in the back?"
Microsoft never had a self image of "Don't Be Evil", and is more a close releative of Cantrill's Lawnmower.
My suspicion is that ruthlessness and the long-con have deep roots in Microsoft's culture.
Microsoft only appears to play nice when it has to, and is shameless otherwise.
Re: Getting forked by Microsoft
#678Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, charity. That's exactly what these trillion dollar empires think of those open source maintainers. Microsoft pulled this same stunt multiple times on os maintainers.
Open source has been hijacked by trillion dollar hyperscalers. It's time we switch to "fair source" or "equitable source". Put MAU/DAU/ARR/market cap limits in your license. Open to everyone with a market cap under $1B or revenues under $100M. All others, please see our "business@" email. Place viral terms like the AGPL that requires that all other systems touched by your code to be open - especially the backend/serv…
That's incompatible with why I do OSS. For me OSS is the ratchet for humanity, the way we fight enshittification and force companies to innovate and compete with each other to make better things. As soon as you abandon that mission and split it into fiefdoms, you're now just the thing that true OSS has to disrupt in order for humanity as a whole to get better software.
A shame though it is, helping everybody the same amount is not likely to get your much gratitude from anyone. But that's the job.
Re: Getting forked by Microsoft
#679They all do it. Anytime a corporation comes calling, they're looking for something from you and there's an implicit quid pro quo. I'm not a lawyer, but anytime latin is involved, you better get it in writing and run it by someone who is.
Re: Getting forked by Microsoft
#680> As a sole maintainer of an open source project, I was enthused when Microsoft reached out to set up a meeting to talk about Spegel. The meeting went well, and I felt there was going to be a path forward ripe with cooperation and hopefully a place where I could onboard new maintainers. Seems it isn't the first time Microsoft leads open source maintainers on, trying to extract information about their projects so they…
This feels like the scene from Silicon Valley about brain rape.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_STfy0QQjJY
Also, many large orgs are known to do this.
Billion dollar companies are not hanging out with you to be your friend, even if you're at the table for a reason (you belong there because you know something they don't).
When speaking with big companies, you are not there to impress them.
Speak for impact + meaning, they are so big and brilliant and rich and should already know how.
There are examples where a large corporation simply sponsored the developer and development of an open source project. This should be the way.