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Decreased CO2 during breathwork: emergence of altered states of consciousness

nature.com

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Re: Decreased CO2 during breathwork: emergence of altered states of consciousness

#91

Post by endlessvoid94 »

Davidzheng wrote: post #89
zemvpferreira wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because panicking when you're being rag-dolled by even smallish waves can kill you, let alone waves of consequence. I don't have the words to describe what it feels like to be pushed to the bottom of the ocean by a wave, then just as you feel like you're running out of air be pushed back down by the next wave, and the next wave. You have no idea which direction is up and which is down, or how long it's been since you…

Not the most convincing advertisement

Just a different type of fun. I find avalanche training to have a similar effect for backcountry.

For some it's sobering, for others it's terrifying.

Re: Decreased CO2 during breathwork: emergence of altered states of consciousness

#92

Post by OxO4 »

timewizard wrote: post #69
nikitoci wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s dangerous, since hyperventilating removes co2 from your blood, and raised co2 level is primary trigger for the urge to breathe reflex. It may feel better to hyperventilate and dive longer but you’re risking suddenly blacking out. I’m a free diver and this is one of the first things you are trained not to do, as well as never to dive alone, for safety reasons.

Ah the wisdom has changed. This was more often taught when I was younger, which yes, was quite a while ago. The warnings given then were don't go for depth with this method, exhale occasionally while underwater, and manage your breath again immediately on the surface.

Freedivers are also taught not to exhale underwater, because it wastes oxygen and lowers your CO2 level, making it harder to know when you actually have to come back up. Your body can't sense the level of oxygen it has, so freedivers rely on CO2 levels as a proxy, so messing with it is dangerous.

Re: Decreased CO2 during breathwork: emergence of altered states of consciousness

#93

Post by kragen »

eigenschwarz wrote: post #76
s1artibartfast wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a Neuroscientist and breathwork facilitator, do you think there is any harm in intentional apnea (e.g. free diving, static holds, ect)? At what point does cell damage (not necessarily death), kick in? As someone involved in these sports, I operate under the assumption that any damage would kick in after loss of consciousness. For example, if I hold my breath, even for 4 or 5 minutes but dont pass out, that is an i…

Does this help? I am a physicist with interest in these subjects and have always been wary of breathwork because of tetany and the following studies. What do experts closer to this field make of these? [1] "Brain Damage in Commercial Breath-Hold Divers" https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal... [2] "Do elite breath-hold divers suffer from mild short-term memory impairments?" https://cdnsciencepu…

Thank you, this is terrific! Why should tetany be worrisome?

Edited to add: the second article seems to be about decompression injuries, rather than apnea-induced brain damage?

Re: Decreased CO2 during breathwork: emergence of altered states of consciousness

#94

Post by mnky9800n »

Davidzheng wrote: post #89
zemvpferreira wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because panicking when you're being rag-dolled by even smallish waves can kill you, let alone waves of consequence. I don't have the words to describe what it feels like to be pushed to the bottom of the ocean by a wave, then just as you feel like you're running out of air be pushed back down by the next wave, and the next wave. You have no idea which direction is up and which is down, or how long it's been since you…

Not the most convincing advertisement

I find it highly motivating

Re: Decreased CO2 during breathwork: emergence of altered states of consciousness

#95

Post by kragen »

AStonesThrow wrote: post #62
crowdyriver wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you check the co2 levels on your office? that could be one reason.

For several years in a row, I was living every day suffering from severe sleep deprivation. I was not merely homeless, but living on the streets, and I became really intent on walking around all night, rather than trespass or sit down for a rest, in someplace where I didn't belong. Or I would sit in the IHOP, and drink 2 pots of coffee and stare, zombie-like, until the Sun rose. So I lost a lot of sleep and I dozed w…

This is really valuable information. Thank you.

Re: Decreased CO2 during breathwork: emergence of altered states of consciousness

#96

Post by FrustratedMonky »

Davidzheng wrote: post #89
zemvpferreira wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because panicking when you're being rag-dolled by even smallish waves can kill you, let alone waves of consequence. I don't have the words to describe what it feels like to be pushed to the bottom of the ocean by a wave, then just as you feel like you're running out of air be pushed back down by the next wave, and the next wave. You have no idea which direction is up and which is down, or how long it's been since you…

Not the most convincing advertisement

He's using an anecdote. So, yeah, not a study.

The only point being made is panicked breathing before disaster, versus a little training and a few controlled breaths before disaster. And that he also experienced maybe some of the same mind altering effects of breathing.

Since we all breath, I think in this type of thread we'll find lots of anecdotes around this subject.

Re: Decreased CO2 during breathwork: emergence of altered states of consciousness

#97

Post by taraparo »

kapitanjakc wrote: post #51

From my personal experience, nothing scientific or proven here. I sit in a small office since last few years. A year or so ago I started to get less mentally active, as in things were going on in automatic mode. And I did not feel good in general, a friend who practices Yoga advised me to do breathing exercises. 15-30 mins of deep breaths in open space in early morning, after shower, before breakfast. Followed by 3-5…

I encourage you and everyone else interested to attend a Holotropic Breathwork session to truly grasp the profound impact your breath can have on your mind. This is nothing like your regular five-minute yoga breathing exercise, boxed breathing, or even the Wim Hof breathing. It's a completely different level. These sessions typically last 3 to 5 hours and take place in a safe, supportive setting with a dedicated sitter and experienced facilitators.

And please don’t try this stuff alone at home.

Re: Decreased CO2 during breathwork: emergence of altered states of consciousness

#98

Post by darkerside »

anshumankmr wrote: post #58

I rarely practised breathwork in my life but during my final year of high school I was basically locked in my house, and got a vitamin D deficiencey (quelle surprise) so I took up doing breathing meditation in a public park, and that really worked for me in a highly stressful period of time in my life, which got me some very good results, aced my exams, got into a decent college. I don't think I have applied myself a…

Why not make it a daily habit now?

Re: Decreased CO2 during breathwork: emergence of altered states of consciousness

#99

Post by FrustratedMonky »

nikitoci wrote: post #67
timewizard wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I need to hold my breath underwater for a longer period of time I'll hyperventilate on the surface just a little before diving. In my experience your lungs don't "burn" as quickly and so you can dive a little longer.

It’s dangerous, since hyperventilating removes co2 from your blood, and raised co2 level is primary trigger for the urge to breathe reflex. It may feel better to hyperventilate and dive longer but you’re risking suddenly blacking out. I’m a free diver and this is one of the first things you are trained not to do, as well as never to dive alone, for safety reasons.

So just curious. You do want to have the CO2 levels, so you get the trigger to breath? But to free dive don't you want to stay down longer? So is the method more about dealing with the urges? Mental ways to understand the urge to breath, but be able to block it?

Re: Decreased CO2 during breathwork: emergence of altered states of consciousness

#100

Post by FrustratedMonky »

dukeofdoom wrote: post #21

I don't mean to be too critical, but why is breathwork/meditation so popular in Atheist circles? When I would presume rationality is the goal, and this seems like it would alter it in a negative way. (depriving your brain of oxygen, presumably decreases its ability to think rationally, or at least run at full capacity) I get that someone like Sam Harris, makes bank promoting his meditation app. But his atheist audien…

You are mixing up religion and meditation.

Think of meditation more as a physical exercise for the brain, like yoga. Is yoga a religion, even if it strengthens your core? Many people do it without any religious ideas.

Same with breathing, 'low CO2' sounds bad, but we do have the next breath, the goals isn't continued low CO2, it can lead to increased oxygen later.

As to rationality. Meditation helps declutter thoughts, so that helps with rationality doesn't it? Why would being strung out and stressed be more rational?

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