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Adipose tissue retains an epigenetic memory of obesity after weight loss

nature.com

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Re: Adipose tissue retains an epigenetic memory of obesity after weight loss

#161

Post by gruntbuggly »

john_minsk wrote: post #4

Just went trough Yo-Yo. Any good strategies on how to overcome it for good?

Probably my only good advice is to not take internet advice too seriously, which I'm sure you are aware of. The most epistemologically sound advice i can give is try everything and find what works for you. Lots of internet people advocate for low carb approaches for many apparently valid reasons. Recently, i tried eating whole food plant based and it's been an amazing 2 weeks (yes incredibly short time to report). I'm not trying that hard, i'm eating well, and feel amazing. If i keep going I'll probably supplement protein, vitamin b, omegas, fish, etc, but my weight is just falling off so far, unlike any other eating plan i've tried. Not super strict either. Eating whatever i want when i eat out, but i like how it makes me feel so i tend to stick with it when possible. Your mileage will vary. It's literally 2 weeks so far lol

Re: Adipose tissue retains an epigenetic memory of obesity after weight loss

#162

Post by Aurornis »

meindnoch wrote: post #82

Well, yeah. Adipocytes multiply when you get fat. But when you lose weight, they don't apoptose, they just shrink in volume by giving up their lipid stores.

Similar adaptions occur in muscle. The extent of new muscle fiber development (hyperplasia) is debated, so there are multiples factors influencing how muscle retains some memory of past strength ability.

Once you’ve reached a level of physical strength it’s easier to return to that level in the future. This has been a topic of debate in the sports world because past anabolic steroid use could therefore carry benefits into the future long after the athlete has stopped using the steroid. Non-professional athletes shouldn’t get too excited about using steroids, though, because the damage steroids do to the body’s own hormone systems also has lasting effects unless you plan on doing TRT for the rest of your life, which has its own downsides.

For average people this does show the importance of getting at least some exercise when you’re young. It’s much easier to get a little bit fit when you’re young which then makes it easier to stay fit in the future. Never too late too start.

Re: Adipose tissue retains an epigenetic memory of obesity after weight loss

#163

Post by xeromal »

nradov wrote: post #54
spoiler wrote: post #2

As someone who's struggled with weight loss, and have known others to struggle with it well, I think we colloquially called this "slow metabolism". It always did feel like it was easier to gain weight than lose it, especially fat weight and not muscle weight for me. I was recently sent a video about fat adaptation (basically teaching your body to be better at burning fat) by a very fit friend, but I wonder how much o…

A lot of people blame failure to lose fat on a "slow metabolism" but this is usually incorrect. Have you had an actual resting metabolic rate (RMR) test to quantity your baseline total daily energy expenditure? Fat adaptation is a real thing. Endurance athletes focused on longer events will target some of their training around that energy system. This is more complex than can really be explained in an online comment…

I think you missed the point that he said "slow metabolism" is just a colloquial term for something else.

Re: Adipose tissue retains an epigenetic memory of obesity after weight loss

#164

Post by ben7799 »

Aurornis wrote: post #162
meindnoch wrote: post #82

Well, yeah. Adipocytes multiply when you get fat. But when you lose weight, they don't apoptose, they just shrink in volume by giving up their lipid stores.

Similar adaptions occur in muscle. The extent of new muscle fiber development (hyperplasia) is debated, so there are multiples factors influencing how muscle retains some memory of past strength ability. Once you’ve reached a level of physical strength it’s easier to return to that level in the future. This has been a topic of debate in the sports world because past anabolic steroid use could therefore carry benefits…

I can't remember exactly what I was listening to, maybe some kind of NPR podcast.

But the doctor was mentioning that none of the influencers influencing young people to try T and Steroids (which is rampant right now) are ever mentioning that you are on a ticking clock to infertility as soon as you start this stuff. Some people can regain their fertility but it might take years, and some people are going to be permanently infertile even staying on HRT.

Plenty of those "alpha male" guys on social media are shooting blanks.

Re: Adipose tissue retains an epigenetic memory of obesity after weight loss

#166

Post by krapht »

throwup238 wrote: post #93
spoiler wrote: post #2

As someone who's struggled with weight loss, and have known others to struggle with it well, I think we colloquially called this "slow metabolism". It always did feel like it was easier to gain weight than lose it, especially fat weight and not muscle weight for me. I was recently sent a video about fat adaptation (basically teaching your body to be better at burning fat) by a very fit friend, but I wonder how much o…

The physical mechanism is mitochondrial uncoupling proteins (UCP). They regulate how much energy is wasted as heat when converting ADP to ATP, determining how efficient one’s metabolism is. When you lose weight, your UCP proteins start wasting less and less energy when producing ATP, which is one of the things that makes dieting so hard. Actually affecting that pathway is largely beyond us at the moment (that’s the b…

Is this similar to what 2, 4 dinitrophenol affects?

Re: Adipose tissue retains an epigenetic memory of obesity after weight loss

#167

Post by ben7799 »

ykonstant wrote: post #36
sethammons wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

10k calories a day is what a black bear eats preparing for hibernation. And it is what Michael Phelps would eat daily when training in the pool for hours on end. Obese people can remain obese eating 1000 calories a day. I recall one episode of My 600lb Life and the show's featured person that day was at 900 or 1200 calories a day and still didn't lose weight. Might have still been gaining. It is a dynamic system. Peo…

>Obese people can remain obese eating 1000 calories a day. I recall one episode of My 600lb Life and the show's featured person that day was at 900 or 1200 calories a day and still didn't lose weight. Might have still been gaining. How is that possible? There is a lower bound on calories needed (on average across say six months) to maintain life. Adding to that the calories needed to maintain the weight, I don't see…

It happens because we act like calories are calories when it's clearly not true.

Calorie counts in nutrition data are generated by something like burning the food in a bomb calorimeter. Which is most definitely not what our bodies do. We have all kinds of different biochemical ways of metabolizing different types of foods.

So someone eating 1000 calories of day could be eating very healthy or they could be ingesting a whole bunch of garbage full of sweeteners. It doesn't seem like anyone really understands how it works but all those sweeteners are more likely to make you gain weight.

Re: Adipose tissue retains an epigenetic memory of obesity after weight loss

#168

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

amonon wrote: post #156
e40 wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For me, sugar was the reason I couldn't lose weight. I got a CGM (continuous glucose monitor) and got my blood sugar under control, and with very little effort I lost a lot of weight. I use 90% cacao Lindt to control my sweet tooth. 1/2 the bar has 4g of sugar, and I consume it over hours. It also has the side effect of reducing my hunger. If you eat much of 90% chocolate, it makes you feel nausea. The trick is to pu…

This also speaks to another point, when trying to lose weight: you must find new things to enjoy.

This is actually great advice for any bad habit you're trying to break. In general, just thinking "Stop doing this thing" (or "do less of this thing"), doesn't really work. It's usually more effective to find something else that you do enjoy (and is better for you), and try to do more of that thing and have it "crowd out" your bad habit.

When it comes to eating, there is a nutritionist with a pretty sizable online following (Kylie Sakaida), and I love one of her mantras of "add, don't subtract". That is, don't think of abstaining from foods you like that might be unhealthy, but instead try to add more healthy things to that food to make it a balanced meal. For example, she gives the example of wanting a frozen waffle for breakfast. Instead of thinking "No, I can't have this frozen waffle", she instead makes a spread using Greek yogurt to add protein, then adds fresh fruit and nuts for more nutrients, fiber and healthy fats, so what started as an 'empty carbs' meal is turned into a pretty balanced, filling breakfast.

Re: Adipose tissue retains an epigenetic memory of obesity after weight loss

#169

Post by tekla »

ben7799 wrote: post #167
ykonstant wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Obese people can remain obese eating 1000 calories a day. I recall one episode of My 600lb Life and the show's featured person that day was at 900 or 1200 calories a day and still didn't lose weight. Might have still been gaining. How is that possible? There is a lower bound on calories needed (on average across say six months) to maintain life. Adding to that the calories needed to maintain the weight, I don't see…

It happens because we act like calories are calories when it's clearly not true. Calorie counts in nutrition data are generated by something like burning the food in a bomb calorimeter. Which is most definitely not what our bodies do. We have all kinds of different biochemical ways of metabolizing different types of foods. So someone eating 1000 calories of day could be eating very healthy or they could be ingesting…

Why is it that people claim the laws of thermodynamics do not apply to humans?

Re: Adipose tissue retains an epigenetic memory of obesity after weight loss

#170

Post by tekla »

raincom wrote: post #149
nom wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is more likely: - a physics-breaking thermodynamic anomaly - a food addicted person is lying about their consumption 200 kcal a day.. yeah sure. A human body needs more than that just to breathe and pump blood. Even comatose a skinny person needs 5 times as much. Overweight people have a significantly higher metabolic base rate. Just breathing can easily be 1000kcal a day if your lungs have to move 30 kilos of u…

If you treat humans as biological machines, signaling system (hormones, endocrine system) is very important. When signaling system is messed up, your CI/CO model with self-control doesn't work at all. Signals need to be fixed.

So? That doesn't disprove the premise of CI/CO. CI/CO is the notion that humans exist in the physical world and thus obey the laws of thermodynamics.
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