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I speak at Harvard as it faces its biggest crisis since 1636

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Re: I speak at Harvard as it faces its biggest crisis since 1636

#101

Post by nkassis »

rofo1 wrote: post #53
mgkimsal wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.harvard.edu/research-funding/wp-content/uploads/... Did you read the demands? "By August 2025, the University must adopt and implement merit-based hiring policies, and cease all preferences based on race, color, religion, sex, or national origin throughout its hiring, promotion, compensation, and related practices among faculty, staff, and leadership. Such adoption and implementation must be durable and d…

You say that they are "demands". As if the taxpayers should automatically give billions to Harvard, no matter what Harvard does. That's insanity (to me at least). "Harvard has in recent years failed to live up to both the intellectual and civil rights conditions that justify federal investment." "The United States has invested in Harvard University’s operations because of the value to the country of scholarly discove…

Research grants come with stipulations on how research is conducted, these grants were already granted so this is essentially breaking their contract. So there is no by default grant, generally the grants also don't delve into what the school can teach and hire for teaching which is very much protected by first amendment rights.

Considering a private university rights to hire and teach as they wish as communism is definitely an odd definition of communism I've rarely seen.

Re: I speak at Harvard as it faces its biggest crisis since 1636

#102

Post by guelo »

edanm wrote: post #99
guelo wrote: post #33

It is the bipartisan innovation in pro-Zionist legal tools, from the "war on terror" to last year's attacks on student protesters, that has eroded our constitutional safeguards to the point that a legitimate autocratic coup is being attempted.

Am I misunderstanding, or are you blaming Zionism for the erosion of all constitutional safeguards? Including specifically the "war on terror"? That is dangerously close to blaming Jews for secretly controlling the world.

1) I said Zionists not Jews. Many of the policymakers were not Jewish.

2) A big part of the Iraq war blunder was planned and promoted by neocons with explicit Zionist intentions.

Re: I speak at Harvard as it faces its biggest crisis since 1636

#103

Post by s1artibartfast »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #98
s1artibartfast wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[edit] Don't kill the messenger... I think the clearest and most cogent articulation I have seen was given by Marc Andreesen back in January, in a 4 hour podcast on Trump policy with Lex Friedman, starting at 58 min. His position was that University reform is not possible. Instead, the institutions themselves need to be destroyed so that new institutions can replace them with more agreeable values [1]. Relevant highl…

For what it’s worth, thank you for posting this. I disagree with it. But at least it’s a coherent argument. (Well, it’s wrong in assuming these institutions would go bankrupt without federal funding. They wouldn’t. The Tier II schools would. But Harvard is absolutely fine running as a private corporation.)

Thanks. For the record, I directionally agree with the problem statement, but not the proposed solution.

I dont think it would work unless they find a way to impact the public schools. They has far greater PR and legal challenges, but the institutions themselves are far more vulnerable to funding cuts if those are surmounted. For example, the University of California system has a 30 billion endowment, but supports 300k students plus 250k faculty, staff, and administrators. However, the UC endowments are growing rapidly, up from 20 billion in 2019.

If the federal government can somehow blow up all the state universities (e.g. loan denial), it wont matter if there are some Ivy League holdouts. Even then, this is probably worse than the problem.

Re: I speak at Harvard as it faces its biggest crisis since 1636

#104

Post by NekkoDroid »

amazingamazing wrote: post #85
metalliqaz wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

End what? The government paying for research? I think that's a foolish idea.

Public Money going to private schools.

If we follow that thought through public money also shouldn't go to private companies.

Re: I speak at Harvard as it faces its biggest crisis since 1636

#105

Post by amazingamazing »

mcculley wrote: post #94
amazingamazing wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re misunderstanding - I’m saying it should be only going to public universities, not private.

I understood that but had the sense backwards. If the best research institution for given grant is a private university, you are saying that it should be precluded from consideration.

Yes. There are plenty of great public universities.

Re: I speak at Harvard as it faces its biggest crisis since 1636

#106

Post by amazingamazing »

NekkoDroid wrote: post #104
amazingamazing wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Public Money going to private schools.

If we follow that thought through public money also shouldn't go to private companies.

Agreed. Let’s do that too.

Re: I speak at Harvard as it faces its biggest crisis since 1636

#107

Post by mcculley »

amazingamazing wrote: post #105
mcculley wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understood that but had the sense backwards. If the best research institution for given grant is a private university, you are saying that it should be precluded from consideration.

Yes. There are plenty of great public universities.

We could extend this thinking to all public expenditures. National Socialism is getting popular again.

Re: I speak at Harvard as it faces its biggest crisis since 1636

#108

Post by EA-3167 »

jampekka wrote: post #100
EA-3167 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The shame IMO is that this is going to further polarize people along the lines of "Yay, stick it to those rich schools" and "Omg, this is literally the second coming of Hitler." It would be lovely to have a broad conversation about why it makes no sense for the government to play HR manager for universities, and ALSO ask why billions in tax money is perennially given to ultra-wealthy, exclusive universities who are o…

The paper you linked is topically - and perhaps a bit ironically - co-authored with an Israel funded thinktank. I'd think it's safe to say there's a lot more pro-zionist than anti-zionist funding in US academia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institute_for_the_Study_of_Glo...

> The paper you linked is topically - and perhaps a bit ironically - co-authored with an Israel funded thinktank.

It's also made by a number of respected academics and academic institutions, and all you've done is ignore the content in favor of attacking a respectable source.

Re: I speak at Harvard as it faces its biggest crisis since 1636

#109

Post by [deleted] »

mgkimsal wrote: post #62
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they are claiming that the Federal government will not invest money until Harvard gets rid of the communist/socialist rhetoric They're changing the terms of the trade after a contract was signed. At the very least, this is the U.S. defaulting on commitments. That said, I broadly agree with you--the U.S. shouldn't be funding Harvard. And the public shouldn't have a say--or continuing economic stake, the way we do wi…

This is Trump's trademark move , writ large. We've all read the reports of him refusing to pay contractors after work is done, ignoring the contracts and saying "sue me". This is who he is , and he's just bringing this playbook (back) to the federal government, cheered on by people until they're personally and directly affected by this behaviour.

[deleted]

Re: I speak at Harvard as it faces its biggest crisis since 1636

#110

Post by amazingamazing »

mcculley wrote: post #107
amazingamazing wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. There are plenty of great public universities.

We could extend this thinking to all public expenditures. National Socialism is getting popular again.

Yes. Private institutions shouldn't get public money.
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