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Trump exempts phones, computers, chips from ‘reciprocal’ tariffs

bloomberg.com

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Re: Trump exempts phones, computers, chips from ‘reciprocal’ tariffs

#161

Post by JustExAWS »

gbil wrote: post #139
jonplackett wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the only explanation that has made sense to me so far. And it makes even more sense based on these exemptions. https://www.instagram.com/share/_jW_V1hwM This is Senator Chris Murphy explaining it’s not economic policy, it’s an attempt to blackmail corporations into submission by making a deal with him in return for sanctions relief. Keep an eye out for what Apple and nvidia might have agreed to give.

This assumes that he has more power than the tech companies on the everyday life and I wonder if that is really the case. As I'm not located in the states, I'm very much interested to hear from a US resident if that is really the case.

A tech company can’t shoot me with impunity under “qualified immunity”. Put me in jail, harass me because I don’t look like a belong in my own neighborhood, take my property under civil forfeiture without a trial…

Re: Trump exempts phones, computers, chips from ‘reciprocal’ tariffs

#162

Post by foogazi »

joshuanapoli wrote: post #144
nabla9 wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This reeks "pay to play" very typical for banana republics. Donations to presidential inauguration fund to get access to the president was already tradition in the US. Trump government just exploits it without shame.

This is a populism move, not pay-to-play. The imminent reality would have been this: many Americans will want to take a vacation to Canada to get a deal on their phone. That just doesn’t make sense.

Where do you see the populism in favoring Apple, Nvidia, Dell ?

Re: Trump exempts phones, computers, chips from ‘reciprocal’ tariffs

#163

Post by Spooky23 »

tobias3 wrote: post #141
stefan_ wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Import Chinese battery: 145% tariff Import Chinese battery inside Chinese laptop: 20% tariff Import Chinese battery inside Vietnamese laptop: 0% tariff Truly this will bring back American manufacturing!

The factories will be disassembling the laptops, taking out the batteries. Then the empty laptops will be sent back to China. That will increase exports to China as well.

That's another patronage angle. When the feds buy Lenovo laptops, they have to comply with TAA. So they ship the laptops to Texas, "materially transform" them, package and ship to the customer.

You can be sure some crony owns the company that screws the display and puts stickers on the laptop with minimum wage workers.

Re: Trump exempts phones, computers, chips from ‘reciprocal’ tariffs

#164

Post by foogazi »

cinbun8 wrote: post #30

From an outsider’s perspective, it’s difficult to discern any coherent U.S. strategy—assuming one even exists. One day it’s a 145% tariff on China. The next, it’s “Well, it’s still 145%, but Apple and Nvidia are exempted because their stock prices might take a hit.” Then comes a 90-day pause, adding to the confusion. It’s not clear whether Jamieson Greer is actually steering this, or if any of it was thoroughly thoug…

> but Apple and Nvidia are exempted because their stock prices might take a hit

They already took a hit - which they monetized by both ways

Re: Trump exempts phones, computers, chips from ‘reciprocal’ tariffs

#166

Post by jeswin »

I am among the few who think it might eventually prove itself a good idea.

To start with, Europe has no good cards to play. Ultimately, Europe will side with the United States while it builds self-sufficiency on several fronts, especially defense. Europe also recognizes that the complete relocation of production capacity into China wasn't good in the long run; it's just that they had no ability to act on their own.

The US has repeatedly suggested publicly that it's not entirely about tariffs, and more might have been said privately. The tariffs the EU and Britain will drop are probably not what the US is after; what the US wants is to reduce global demand for Chinese manufacturing. Europe will find it easier to sell this—bringing manufacturing back and protectionism even at the cost of say, welfare and environment—to the public due to the violent shakedown over the past two weeks, as well as what happened with Ukraine and Russia. Ongoing European emergency measures to increase defense spending will be followed by incentives to rebuild strategic industry—like how China supported civilian–military partnership with policy.

Meanwhile the Indian government is already looking for ways to replace Chinese imports with US imports, where it can [1]. Japan and North Korea will follow suit; Trump is already saying that Korea needs to pay for US troops.

The US is (in my view) on solid footing here. At the very least, they get better trade deals from everyone else—Europe, India, Korea, Japan, Taiwan, etc. A number of companies will move production back into the US, and the government can prioritize those with more military value (chip-making, batteries, cars, shipbuilding [2] , etc.). And if the US can convince others to start decoupling from China, this will weaken Chinese manufacturing capacity.

Given the pain it's going to inflict in the short term, Trump is the only person who could have started this trade war. There might have been ways to do this without such a shake-up, but I am not convinced that this was a stupid move.

This was an anti-China move right from the beginning, disguised as an outrage against everyone's tariffs.

[1]: https://www.financialexpress.com/business/industry/replace-c...

[2]: https://www.scmp.com/economy/china-economy/article/3306177/u...

To clarify: none of this is China's fault. They did a fantastic job for their country, pulling hundreds of millions of people out of poverty.

Re: Trump exempts phones, computers, chips from ‘reciprocal’ tariffs

#167

Post by steveBK123 »

netsharc wrote: post #137
steveBK123 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "smart trumpers" I know have already staked out the entire range of possible outcomes: 1) He is completely restructuring global trade and decoupling us from China which is tough but necessary medicine because our biggest geopolitical adversary cannot be our largest trading partner 2) You can't believe half of what he says, he's all bluster, he's addicted to deals and will sign some fake deals to score a domestic…

Thinking the status quo will return so easily is like Putin pulling out of Ukraine and saying "So we're back to 23rd January (Edit/Correction: February) 2022, right, friends?". The trust in the US (dollar) hegemony has now been eroded, and will probably continue until a purge of the regime of idiots (not just the oust of one idiot...).

Well yes, either position was dismissibly stupid.

No president is going to ride out a self-imposed multi-year global trade reconfiguration triggering inflation, shortages and unemployment.

Nor is putting the genie back in the bottle possible now and so even if you return to status quo trade policy, you've now spooked the world re: reliability of US as partners, US dollar, US debt, etc.

Worst of both worlds really. Incredible self owns over and over.

Re: Trump exempts phones, computers, chips from ‘reciprocal’ tariffs

#168

Post by ojbyrne »

foogazi wrote: post #162
joshuanapoli wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a populism move, not pay-to-play. The imminent reality would have been this: many Americans will want to take a vacation to Canada to get a deal on their phone. That just doesn’t make sense.

Where do you see the populism in favoring Apple, Nvidia, Dell ?

There is no favoring of Apple, Nvidia or Dell. The headline is misleading. “and others” is doing a lot of heavy lifting.

Re: Trump exempts phones, computers, chips from ‘reciprocal’ tariffs

#169

Post by jm4 »

steveBK123 wrote: post #114
jm4 wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s total bullshit. Part of my business involves direct import and that’s now impacted by tariffs. The cherry on top is that what I import is not and cannot be produced in the U.S. I source a number of other products from suppliers in the U.S. and literally every single one of them is impacted by tariffs somehow, whether it’s ingredients, packaging, etc. that comes from somewhere else. Some of my materials originate…

The whole thing strikes me as a bunch of nepobaby/fake academic/banker bro advisors who have no idea how the physical world works. As much as I think Musk is a bad actor at this point, talking to him about supply chains would have highlighted how insane this whole plan was from day 1. My dad is a retired EE who dealt with the 90s offshoring wave and described the process of spinning up offshore production with a new…

It’s pure stupidity and most people don’t even realize it. Last night I met a couple at a country club where I was a guest - one of those $100k/yr places - and they asked me if my trade partners are charging me more with the tariffs. I told them the U.S. government is charging me more with the tariffs and my trade partners are charging me more because the value of the dollar is down. This was the first time anyone told them it’s the importer who pays the tariff and that it will be passed to the customer in multiples to maintain the same profit margin. Man, to be wealthy enough to be a member at a place like that and to be able to live in ignorant bliss… What a life.

Re: Trump exempts phones, computers, chips from ‘reciprocal’ tariffs

#170

Post by Spooky23 »

buzzerbetrayed wrote: post #31
kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #13

Seems a bit anti-business to have an unequal playing field just for the star-bellied sneetches. Also silly that those with the biggest piles of capital are getting exemptions when the whole purpose of this exercise is to spur local investment in manufacturing. If anything, small businesses below some threshold of revenue/staff should be getting exemptions.

Companies aren’t getting exemptions. The product categories are. The headline is misleading. And while you might already be aware of that, most the people responding to you clearly aren’t.

True, yet irrelevant. If Apple imports garlic for it's cafeteria, that will be tariffed. But those commodity categories represent the business of the named companies, and those companies represent the majority of the value of imports to the US in those categories.
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