Germany creates 'super–high-tech ministry' for research, technology, aerospace • Hacker News Board

Re: Germany creates 'super–high-tech ministry' for research, technology, aerospace

#61

Post by ndr42 » Fri, Apr 11, 2025, 9:41 PM UTC

pmags wrote: post #3

johndoe0815 wrote: post #2

And it will probably be headed by one of the most incompetent and corrupt politicians they were able to find. Disgusting.

Evidence? Citations? Suggested reading?

The CSU has a history of putting people in charge that do not benefit germany but bavaria (the only part of germany where the party CSU is active), e.g. Andreas Scheuer [1][2].

Notable recent examples of corruption are the Maskenaffäre [4] or Julia Klöckner and Nestlé ("Julia Klöckner and Nestlé show how the greasy closeness between politics and business can go too far" [5]).

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andreas_Scheuer: "Scheuer's ministry is said to have broken budgetary and public procurement law when concluding the multi-billion dollar contracts with the operators and "deliberately deceived" the Bundestag about the real costs of the car toll."

[2] Söder (party leader of CSU) said about Scheuer: "I don't know not many ministers that bring so much money to bavaria as Andreas Scheuer" [3]

[3] German: "Bei allem, was der ein oder andere kritisiert an dem Andi Scheuer: Ich kenne wenige Minister, die so viel Geld nach Bayern holen, wie der Andi Scheuer. Auch das muss man einfach mal in der Bilanz ehrlicherweise bitte nach draußen sagen."

[4] https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maskenaffäre

5] https://www.spiegel.de/politik/julia-kloeckner-und-nestle-ze...

Re: Germany creates 'super–high-tech ministry' for research, technology, aerospace

#62

Post by fxtentacle » Fri, Apr 11, 2025, 9:41 PM UTC

foobarian wrote: post #46

fxtentacle wrote: post #26

The upside is that this will actually provide lots of research funding to small companies. Think of it like the seed round from a VC, but instead of investing into new companies, they try to strategically invest into existing companies to boost future tax revenue. It'll probably be very German, meaning overly bureaucratic. But the basic idea of financing R&D in small companies to grow them more competitive seems legi…

Didn't we get MP3s this way? Or is that a slightly different pathway

Fraunhofer is (by now) only financed 30% through tax money and 70% comes from the royalties on their past developments like MP3 and H264 and H265 and MPEG-H.

Anyway, Fraunhofer gets recurring tax funding. What voize got is a one-off research grant to a group of companies:

- voize

- Charité - Universitätsmedizin Berlin (a medical university)

- Deutsches Forschungszentrum für Künstliche Intelligenz GmbH, Berlin (a government AI research lab)

- Connext Communication GmbH, Paderborn (a tech company)

- Kleeblatt Pflegeheime gGmbH, Ludwigsburg (a retirement home, i.e. potential end user)

- Pflegewohnhaus am Waldkrankenhaus gGmbH, Berlin (another retirement home)

For this grant type, it's quite common that you pay the inventors, some assistant companies, some researchers, and some end users a lump sum to force them all to work together on commercializing the invention.

Re: Germany creates 'super–high-tech ministry' for research, technology, aerospace

#63

Post by selfmodruntime » Fri, Apr 11, 2025, 9:42 PM UTC

fxtentacle wrote: post #26

The upside is that this will actually provide lots of research funding to small companies. Think of it like the seed round from a VC, but instead of investing into new companies, they try to strategically invest into existing companies to boost future tax revenue. It'll probably be very German, meaning overly bureaucratic. But the basic idea of financing R&D in small companies to grow them more competitive seems legi…

Applying for a grant is normally difficult. In Germany, it's outright hellish. I hope I will be pleasantly surprised.

Re: Germany creates 'super–high-tech ministry' for research, technology, aerospace

#64

Post by ernst_klim » Fri, Apr 11, 2025, 9:42 PM UTC

anigbrowl wrote: post #34

Black_13 appears to be shadowbanned so I'm reproducing their comment here: black_13 11 minutes ago [dead] | parent | context | unvouch | favorite | on: Germany creates 'super–high-tech ministry' for res... The cynicism in these comments is telling, but misses crucial realities about Germany's capabilities and social achievements. Yes, Germany creates bureaucracies. Yes, Dorothee Bär's digital infrastructure record is…

> comprehensive public transportation infrastructure, universal healthcare without administrative bloat, and urban planning that prioritizes livability over speculation.

This can't be further from the truth. This is probably written by an American, and US is a very car-centric, but German infrastructure is a shitshow.

Also healthcare is absolutely stiffled by bureaucracy. I have a friend who is a cardiologist. He says that exactly half of his work time is paperwork. And not just paperwork, but German paperwork, where you manually type PDF fields one by one, then print, then sign, then scan and so on.

Re: Germany creates 'super–high-tech ministry' for research, technology, aerospace

#65

Post by selfmodruntime » Fri, Apr 11, 2025, 9:43 PM UTC

pasabagi wrote: post #36

I actually think Germany would be really good at digital infrastructure if they stopped being afraid of friend computer. Germany is immensely proud of its history of creating standards - there's literally a place in berlin called DIN Platz. Germany is also very proud, and rightly so, in its history of mathematical innovation. Everything that isn't dross in the computer world is either a well designed standard, or a w…

> I actually think Germany would be really good at digital infrastructure if they stopped being afraid of friend computer.

They still have the automotive / electrical engineering mindset on computers and software. Software in Germany is built to achieve a means to an end. It is never the end goal itself.

Re: Germany creates 'super–high-tech ministry' for research, technology, aerospace

#66

Post by franze » Fri, Apr 11, 2025, 9:44 PM UTC

selfmodruntime wrote: post #63

fxtentacle wrote: post #26

The upside is that this will actually provide lots of research funding to small companies. Think of it like the seed round from a VC, but instead of investing into new companies, they try to strategically invest into existing companies to boost future tax revenue. It'll probably be very German, meaning overly bureaucratic. But the basic idea of financing R&D in small companies to grow them more competitive seems legi…

Applying for a grant is normally difficult. In Germany, it's outright hellish. I hope I will be pleasantly surprised.

the good thing now with AI you can write all those pages of bullshit nobody reads bit you will accountable to if things dont work out

Re: Germany creates 'super–high-tech ministry' for research, technology, aerospace

#67

Post by selfmodruntime » Fri, Apr 11, 2025, 9:44 PM UTC

rrr_oh_man wrote: post #31

submeta wrote: post #10

Many German companies want „Digitalisierung“, workflow automation, process improvements, they want to use AI, LLMs, but when it comes to implementing all of that, they are drowning in bureaucracy. What Germans can do is create layers of bureaucracy.

The problem is not the bureaucracy. Nobody's stopping a local mid-market manufacturer from automating workflows. Or hindering a utility company from offering a better service process. The problem is corporate leadership. German companies tend to be run by people who are inflexible, uninspired, and cheap. Maybe it's in the culture. Compare this to Austria, where there's a cultural flair for the dramatic (and therefore…

> The problem is not the bureaucracy

The problem is definitely bureaucracy. Any German founder will agree with this.

Re: Germany creates 'super–high-tech ministry' for research, technology, aerospace

#68

Post by Zigurd » Fri, Apr 11, 2025, 9:45 PM UTC

calmoo wrote: post #50

anigbrowl wrote: post #34

Black_13 appears to be shadowbanned so I'm reproducing their comment here: black_13 11 minutes ago [dead] | parent | context | unvouch | favorite | on: Germany creates 'super–high-tech ministry' for res... The cynicism in these comments is telling, but misses crucial realities about Germany's capabilities and social achievements. Yes, Germany creates bureaucracies. Yes, Dorothee Bär's digital infrastructure record is…

Having no gun violence and having a higher life expectancy than America is not something to be proud of and not a useful benchmark. This comment is a prime example of Germany's inability to take external criticism - it nearly always devolves into comparison with America. You know many non-americans also criticise the state of Germany currently?

/s?

Re: Germany creates 'super–high-tech ministry' for research, technology, aerospace

#69

Post by selfmodruntime » Fri, Apr 11, 2025, 9:46 PM UTC

ernst_klim wrote: post #64

anigbrowl wrote: post #34

Black_13 appears to be shadowbanned so I'm reproducing their comment here: black_13 11 minutes ago [dead] | parent | context | unvouch | favorite | on: Germany creates 'super–high-tech ministry' for res... The cynicism in these comments is telling, but misses crucial realities about Germany's capabilities and social achievements. Yes, Germany creates bureaucracies. Yes, Dorothee Bär's digital infrastructure record is…

> comprehensive public transportation infrastructure, universal healthcare without administrative bloat, and urban planning that prioritizes livability over speculation. This can't be further from the truth. This is probably written by an American, and US is a very car-centric, but German infrastructure is a shitshow. Also healthcare is absolutely stiffled by bureaucracy. I have a friend who is a cardiologist. He say…

> This can't be further from the truth. This is probably written by an American, and US is a very car-centric, but German infrastructure is a shitshow.

I just know that this is a comment from a German person who has little experience with public transport in any non-top-class country. Yeah, it could be better, but it could also be so much worse.

> Also healthcare is absolutely stiffled by bureaucracy

This I agree with.

Re: Germany creates 'super–high-tech ministry' for research, technology, aerospace

#70

Post by dennis_jeeves2 » Fri, Apr 11, 2025, 9:46 PM UTC

anigbrowl wrote: post #34

Black_13 appears to be shadowbanned so I'm reproducing their comment here: black_13 11 minutes ago [dead] | parent | context | unvouch | favorite | on: Germany creates 'super–high-tech ministry' for res... The cynicism in these comments is telling, but misses crucial realities about Germany's capabilities and social achievements. Yes, Germany creates bureaucracies. Yes, Dorothee Bär's digital infrastructure record is…

>Germans live significantly longer (81.1 years vs America's 76.4)

Got to point out a nuance here.

Americans living shorter are partly the result of America's success. An aggressive big pharma and a health care system that over medicates the population and give them bad advise ( eg nutrition) is one reason why they live less. Often more technology/business is not necessarily good. Germany's overall better outcome with result to life expectancy can be attributed to their incompetence/bureaucracy but certainly not a conscious decision to be better.