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Why Tap a Wheel of Cheese?

cheeseprofessor.com

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Re: Why Tap a Wheel of Cheese?

#11

Post by perihelions »

SamBam wrote: post #4

I am glad that this continues to be done by hand, and expect, based on Italian attitudes towards food and tradition, that it will continue being done by hand for another hundred years. It is interesting how important it seems to us that jobs like this remain done in the traditional way. For all their expertise, I am sure a technical solution would also easily be able to detect what they are looking for: voids within…

- "For all their expertise, I am sure a technical solution would also easily be able to detect what they are looking for: voids within the cheese, or lack of uniform density..."

Out of pure curiosity, how would an industrial process engineer approach this problem, de novo?

Re: Why Tap a Wheel of Cheese?

#12

Post by mano78 »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #2

Will an AI be able to do this too? Probably. Hey! I don't think it's a good idea. But if it's cheap and effective, guess how long it will take?

Not even an AI, there are simpler ways. But as an italian, I will be in the pitchforks-armed horrified mob if this will be proposed. Not a chance.

Re: Why Tap a Wheel of Cheese?

#13

Post by 1970-01-01 »

TLDR: The Italian way of doing acoustic, non-destructive testing of a material. This is also done in many other things such as pipelines, chairlifts, and welded metals or machines that have pre-recorded acoustic signatures or sound recordings. Hit it with a hammer, listen to the tone. If it sounds very different, inspect or reject.

Re: Why Tap a Wheel of Cheese?

#15

Post by alwa »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #2

Will an AI be able to do this too? Probably. Hey! I don't think it's a good idea. But if it's cheap and effective, guess how long it will take?

Technically? Not long. Socially and politically? My money’s on the battitore.

Re: Why Tap a Wheel of Cheese?

#16

Post by maxbond »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #2

Will an AI be able to do this too? Probably. Hey! I don't think it's a good idea. But if it's cheap and effective, guess how long it will take?

It's been possible to automate this job away for decades, with no AI necessary. You could image these cheese wheels with ultrasound or X-rays and establish thresholds for the size of voids which are tolerable. This must be a concern wherever parts are cast, so surely there are off the shelf solutions. Presumably this isn't news to the relevant parties and they value having human battitores over the savings.

Re: Why Tap a Wheel of Cheese?

#17

Post by Sanzig »

perihelions wrote: post #11
SamBam wrote: post #4

I am glad that this continues to be done by hand, and expect, based on Italian attitudes towards food and tradition, that it will continue being done by hand for another hundred years. It is interesting how important it seems to us that jobs like this remain done in the traditional way. For all their expertise, I am sure a technical solution would also easily be able to detect what they are looking for: voids within…

- "For all their expertise, I am sure a technical solution would also easily be able to detect what they are looking for: voids within the cheese, or lack of uniform density..." Out of pure curiosity, how would an industrial process engineer approach this problem, de novo?

Industrial CT would probably be pretty effective at giving a density distribution and identifying voids, but that may be overkill - a couple planes of X-ray imaging may be sufficient.

Ultrasound would also be a solid bet, but it depends how many points you need to sample if it would be time efficient.

Re: Why Tap a Wheel of Cheese?

#18

Post by leansensei »

perihelions wrote: post #11
SamBam wrote: post #4

I am glad that this continues to be done by hand, and expect, based on Italian attitudes towards food and tradition, that it will continue being done by hand for another hundred years. It is interesting how important it seems to us that jobs like this remain done in the traditional way. For all their expertise, I am sure a technical solution would also easily be able to detect what they are looking for: voids within…

- "For all their expertise, I am sure a technical solution would also easily be able to detect what they are looking for: voids within the cheese, or lack of uniform density..." Out of pure curiosity, how would an industrial process engineer approach this problem, de novo?

Microphones and spectral analysis. Or the same equipment used for flaw detection of welds with ultrasound.

Re: Why Tap a Wheel of Cheese?

#19

Post by ano-ther »

perihelions wrote: post #11
SamBam wrote: post #4

I am glad that this continues to be done by hand, and expect, based on Italian attitudes towards food and tradition, that it will continue being done by hand for another hundred years. It is interesting how important it seems to us that jobs like this remain done in the traditional way. For all their expertise, I am sure a technical solution would also easily be able to detect what they are looking for: voids within…

- "For all their expertise, I am sure a technical solution would also easily be able to detect what they are looking for: voids within the cheese, or lack of uniform density..." Out of pure curiosity, how would an industrial process engineer approach this problem, de novo?

Ultrasound seems to be viable

> A study on structural quality control of Swiss‐type cheese with ultrasound is presented. We used a longitudinal mode pulse‐echo setup using 1–2MHz ultrasonic frequencies to detect cheese‐eyes and ripening induced cracks. Results show that the ultrasonic method posses good potential to monitor the cheese structure during the ripening process. Preliminary results indicate that maturation stage could be monitored with ultrasonic velocity measurements.

https://pubs.aip.org/aip/acp/article-abstract/894/1/1328/953...

Re: Why Tap a Wheel of Cheese?

#20

Post by hooverd »

SamBam wrote: post #4

I am glad that this continues to be done by hand, and expect, based on Italian attitudes towards food and tradition, that it will continue being done by hand for another hundred years. It is interesting how important it seems to us that jobs like this remain done in the traditional way. For all their expertise, I am sure a technical solution would also easily be able to detect what they are looking for: voids within…

Maybe, and the promise of AI nowadays seems to be "we'll automate art and science and creativity so you have more time to do low-value manufacturing".
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