Major report on alcohol finds moderate drinking tied to lower mortality
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Re: Major report on alcohol finds moderate drinking tied to lower mortality
#2These reports only make sense to me if I take a "substitution model" in mind. My idea being that it is not likely that alcohol itself is healthy, but there are some pretty good feedback loops that prevent people from drinking too much alcohol that don't really exist for many of the replacement drinks.
As such, many people that drink "moderately" also drink less of all things. Often times, their "one drink with dinner" is all they drink, period. Contrasted to the bottomless soda drinks that are also on offer.
Granted, I'm still not clear I have internalized my few trips to other countries. I had assumed people would drink more water. I was, evidently, very wrong. It is still puzzling to me how little water I was able to get on the regular when out.
Re: Major report on alcohol finds moderate drinking tied to lower mortality
#3These reports only make sense to me if I take a "substitution model" in mind. My idea being that it is not likely that alcohol itself is healthy, but there are some pretty good feedback loops that prevent people from drinking too much alcohol that don't really exist for many of the replacement drinks. As such, many people that drink "moderately" also drink less of all things. Often times, their "one drink with dinner…
The theory about moderation being a trait that applies to a person in general makes sense.
However, I think the most health-conscious people today probably don't drink at all due to recent sentiment leaning more toward even moderate drinking being harmful. I also assume their health-awareness would preclude them from replacing alcohol with sugary drinks or other unhealthy options.
So I continue to find it interesting when studies show reduced all-cause mortality for moderate drinkers.
Re: Major report on alcohol finds moderate drinking tied to lower mortality
#4I tried to find my answer with their document, but the search interface is awful.
Can anyone tell if this factors in the confounder of the very-sick or chronically ill often being teetotalers, so making the "never drink" category look worse for reasons unrelated to any supposed benefits of alcohol consumption? It's my understanding that was supposed to explain prior findings like this.
Re: Major report on alcohol finds moderate drinking tied to lower mortality
#5These reports only make sense to me if I take a "substitution model" in mind. My idea being that it is not likely that alcohol itself is healthy, but there are some pretty good feedback loops that prevent people from drinking too much alcohol that don't really exist for many of the replacement drinks. As such, many people that drink "moderately" also drink less of all things. Often times, their "one drink with dinner…
The theory about moderation being a trait that applies to a person in general makes sense. However, I think the most health-conscious people today probably don't drink at all due to recent sentiment leaning more toward even moderate drinking being harmful. I also assume their health-awareness would preclude them from replacing alcohol with sugary drinks or other unhealthy options. So I continue to find it interesting…
I'm curious on numbers, there. Most health-conscious people I know still drink a fair bit. They are also just very active.
Of course, there is the obnoxious thing where the most opinionated person about what you should be eating often turns out to be one of the least healthy at the table.
Re: Major report on alcohol finds moderate drinking tied to lower mortality
#6It’s seems to me that the current “alcohol is bad” messaging coming from health podcasters and influencers (including Andrew Huberman) will be proven wrong in the long term.
Virtually nothing that humans have consumed for thousands of years has been proven to be bad for you after further research. Virtually nothing. The idea that we invented alcohol then consumed it for thousands of years by mistake is ridiculous. It’s like when eggs were bad for you because of cholesterol.
It’s preposterous, and it comes from the excessive focus on measurable outcomes coming from medical testing.
It’s like my neurologist once told me, after a scare, that I was a victim of VOMIT. I asked him what the heck was that - he said Victim of Modern Imaging Technology.
Huberman (etc) are likely following the same pattern. They saw a pattern in the data saying “alcohol is bad”.
What could be better for a health obsessed person? We know alcohol has bad effects, we know alcoholism is a problem. Let’s just say it’s all a problem.
But… Living in a Southern European country, it’s ridiculous. We don’t have the same rates of alcoholism as northern countries, and from that pov, Huberman’s Puritanism just sounds absurd. From that perspective, alcohol is just a mild sedative, with wonderful antidepressant effects.
Seems silly.
Re: Major report on alcohol finds moderate drinking tied to lower mortality
#7I tried to find my answer with their document, but the search interface is awful. Can anyone tell if this factors in the confounder of the very-sick or chronically ill often being teetotalers, so making the "never drink" category look worse for reasons unrelated to any supposed benefits of alcohol consumption? It's my understanding that was supposed to explain prior findings like this.
Could also be that moderate drinking could help you find friends and a mate, both of which decrease mortality.
Re: Major report on alcohol finds moderate drinking tied to lower mortality
#8I tried to find my answer with their document, but the search interface is awful. Can anyone tell if this factors in the confounder of the very-sick or chronically ill often being teetotalers, so making the "never drink" category look worse for reasons unrelated to any supposed benefits of alcohol consumption? It's my understanding that was supposed to explain prior findings like this.
Not answering your question, but my understanding is that it's well known that this is one of those paradoxical correlations.
Granted I have no source for this other than I feel like I've read it somewhere, but you're definitely not the only one to have this idea.
Re: Major report on alcohol finds moderate drinking tied to lower mortality
#9I tried to find my answer with their document, but the search interface is awful. Can anyone tell if this factors in the confounder of the very-sick or chronically ill often being teetotalers, so making the "never drink" category look worse for reasons unrelated to any supposed benefits of alcohol consumption? It's my understanding that was supposed to explain prior findings like this.
Could also be that moderate drinking could help you find friends and a mate, both of which decrease mortality.
Exercise, diet and regular checkups are the key to living longer.
It may be that people who are moderate drinkers are more likely to do all or most of the above.
Re: Major report on alcohol finds moderate drinking tied to lower mortality
#10These reports only make sense to me if I take a "substitution model" in mind. My idea being that it is not likely that alcohol itself is healthy, but there are some pretty good feedback loops that prevent people from drinking too much alcohol that don't really exist for many of the replacement drinks. As such, many people that drink "moderately" also drink less of all things. Often times, their "one drink with dinner…
The theory about moderation being a trait that applies to a person in general makes sense. However, I think the most health-conscious people today probably don't drink at all due to recent sentiment leaning more toward even moderate drinking being harmful. I also assume their health-awareness would preclude them from replacing alcohol with sugary drinks or other unhealthy options. So I continue to find it interesting…
What makes one ‘the most health-conscious?’ Certainly all the fittest people I know drink… everyone in the triathlon group I swim with three times a week at 5:30 am drinks beer or wine, and all the people I go with and meet ski-touring, mountain biking, and backpacking drink. In fact, the city I live in, is regularly noted as one of the booziest towns in the states but if you walk around town there are few people who are not fit as can be. I can’t find good age stats for Bend, Oregon, but I drink and play cribbage a few times a month with some pretty healthy octogenarians. Obviously my sample size is limited.