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Interviewing a software engineer who prepared with AI

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Re: Interviewing a software engineer who prepared with AI

#351

Post by crabbone »

jaredklewis wrote: post #110
no-dr-onboard wrote: post #45

I keep coming back to this phrase used in this post: "it was scary". Yeah, hiring is scary. Hiring is insanely expensive on all fronts. Firing people is difficult, it's expensive and legally exposing. Hiring the wrong person, allowing them access your systems and potentially exfiltrate your IP to them is a hazardous but necessary venture. The thing is, none of these things really changed with AI. People have been lyi…

> - And yeah, you guys, it's time to buy a suit. Others have already commented on this, but do you work in tech? IME getting interviewed by directors and even VPs in t-shirts is the norm. I’ve worn jeans to work my whole career. If anything, I think people in tech have a strong prejudice against people in suits (ie “obviously this person isn’t a real software engineer, they’re wearing a suit.”) Anyway, probably not g…

The only programmers I've ever seen wearing a suit to work were the ones working in a bank. Not sure if that was a requirement or just a local tradition. Just saying that it happens, but seems very rare.

Re: Interviewing a software engineer who prepared with AI

#353

Post by slcjordan »

With AI, the onus is entirely on you to prompt the AI to perform an ethical practice interview and avoid gaining an unethical advantage by having AI make up answers for you.

It just makes me wonder about the importance that an understanding and commitment to ethics will play as people start to use AI more and more in their daily life.

Re: Interviewing a software engineer who prepared with AI

#354

Post by acjacobson »

I've run into something similar twice now in the last month. A candidate pauses or says 'let me think about that' on a relatively simple question as if to give an LLM time to respond. After the pause they give an overly long detailed answer - again like an LLM response.

One candidate was absolutely stumped and could not answer why and when they became interested in technology. They couldn't say anything about themselves personally. It was baffling.

Re: Interviewing a software engineer who prepared with AI

#355

Post by crabbone »

sethammons wrote: post #293
drivingmenuts wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The general rule seems to be if you’re not customer-facing, then no suit is needed. Just wear clean, neat clothes and that’s usually enough. If a suit or uniform is needed, that would be noted up front.

The general rule is to dress one step up from those in the role. Everyone in hoodie and shorts? Wear pants. Everyone in collared polos? Go business casual with maybe a blazer. Showing up a level lower makes you look unprepared. Showing up some levels higher, like in a suit to a hoodie shop, shows lack of research and reading a room. In start ups, I have seen candidates nearly rejected just on a suit alone. Def starte…

Erm... no?

The highest ranking person I ever shook hands with was the GP Morgan head of futures department. He came to talk to the whole company to prep for acquisition. So, it wasn't a super official "ceremony", but it was in front of some fifty men, including senior management of the said company. He was wearing a polo shirt, jeans and a pair of sneakers. I don't know if this is how he'd show up to his office in the bank. Likely not (but who knows?)

Also, nobody in that room was wearing a suit.

Maybe your advise works for other places. For vast majority of programming jobs showing up overdressed will raise more questions about your sanity than score any points on preparedness.

Re: Interviewing a software engineer who prepared with AI

#356

Post by motorest »

fzeroracer wrote: post #233
motorest wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This assumes that was the job? What if the job never talks or sits in a room with anyone? That's perfectly fine. Some coding jobs also don't require deep knowledge on data structures. Each company and project has its own requirements. This does not reject the value of soft skills and being able to interact with other people. You can also frame this from another perspective. How far should a hiring manager go to acc…

Sitting in a conference room under pressure after potentially flying out possibly hundreds of miles doesn't test your soft skills in actual day to day work. I've known many excellent engineers that buckle under that conditional.

> Sitting in a conference room under pressure after potentially flying out possibly hundreds of miles doesn't test your soft skills in actual day to day work. I've known many excellent engineers that buckle under that conditional.

You're complaining about the hypothetical effectiveness of concrete hiring practices. You are not rejecting the value and importance of soft skills.

Also, the ability to work under pressure is valuable skill. If you have a candidate that fails to perform when being in a room with someone else, I doubt you can argue that that's your hiring decision when other candidates are able to perform in similar circumstances.

Re: Interviewing a software engineer who prepared with AI

#357

Post by motorest »

ang_cire wrote: post #234
motorest wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Ahh... the age old, "just do better" position for neurodivergent people. Classic bigotry. I think you're too eager to throw personal attacks on those who raise valid points that are you feel are uncomfortable to address. You should be aware that engineering is a social activity that requires hard skills. In any project that employs more than one person, you need to be able to interact with others. This means being…

> they will of course favor those who they are able to effectively interact with. This is not bigotry, is it? If "those who they are able to effectively interact with" ends up meaning only people who look, act, or believe like them, then yes it absolutely is.

> If "those who they are able to effectively interact with" ends up meaning only people who look, act, or believe like them, then yes it absolutely is.

It's everyone. You don't get to cherry pick.

That's why hiring managers should focus on soft skills. Their job is to hire the guy that fits in your organization and everyone in it is able to effortlessly work with. When hiring managers do their job, you don't need to go way out of your way to suffer toxic people who are utterly unpleasant to work with. Hiring managers filter them out. Problem averted.

Re: Interviewing a software engineer who prepared with AI

#359

Post by scarface_74 »

Seattle3503 wrote: post #274
scarface_74 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s called a career document or a brag document. I update mine every quarter. It’s a detailed summary of the projects I worked on in STAR format including challenges I faced.

A lot of folks (and good engineers) arent that career oriented.

It’s not about being careee oriented. It’s knowing that eventually you are going to need to interview for a job.

Re: Interviewing a software engineer who prepared with AI

#360

Post by sgarland »

deadbabe wrote: post #288
no-dr-onboard wrote: post #45

I keep coming back to this phrase used in this post: "it was scary". Yeah, hiring is scary. Hiring is insanely expensive on all fronts. Firing people is difficult, it's expensive and legally exposing. Hiring the wrong person, allowing them access your systems and potentially exfiltrate your IP to them is a hazardous but necessary venture. The thing is, none of these things really changed with AI. People have been lyi…

No Computer Science degree = forget about it. In the past we took a chance hiring people with non traditional backgrounds but now that everyone thinks they can do complex engineering with the help of AI, we need to know people have truly studied the fundamentals over a period of 4 years at a university.

Except you can use AI (against the rules, but there is 0% chance they’re catching everyone) for a degree.

The only way to be sure that I know of is to ask questions in-person. They don’t have to be absurd, just things that you should be able to answer if you understand fundamentals, like “describe the differences between a binary tree and a B-tree,” or “describe the fetch-execute cycle.”

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