After several tourists were detained for weeks in terrible conditions, it’s little wonder why
I'm an EU citizen who's on the organizer team of Elm Camp 2025, and I'm really on the fence whether to even risk the flight to US and attending, hearing these stories :(
Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March
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Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March
#202I guess in the 1930s, Americans had similar thoughts about Germans.
Many americans loved what Hitler was doing to Make Germany Great Again. Charles Lindbergh for example blamed the Jews for WW2 > National polls showed that when England and France declared war on Germany, in 1939, less than 10 percent of our [USA] population favored a similar course for America. ... The three most important groups who have been pressing this country toward war are the British, the Jewish and the Roose…
Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March
#203I'm waiting to see the effects of the brain drain
Know of any good programs that countries are offering to accelerate this?
French universities offering to adopt US academics
Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March
#204Earlier quoted context omitted.
>I think the news feeds within the US may be approximately equal in their delivery of "this is good change" versus "this is catastrophic change", whilst internationally it's almost entirely "this is catastrophic change" with minor pockets of intolerance apologia. Exactly. Americans generally don't understand the degree to which the rest of the world gets the CNN 5min recap of what's going on in the US, and it's very…
> ~half the country doesn't think ICE should be locking up tourists without good reason and the other ~half doesn't think ICE should be locking up anyone That is not remotely a good faith representation of the controversy.
Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March
#205Earlier quoted context omitted.
ICE statements about detention say it's supposed to be non-punitive, but clearly it's punishing for the detained. Lots of people get detained for what are actually civil violations or even just suspicion of civil violations, not crimes. We really need a new system. People shouldn't be locked up for more than 24 hours until they've seen a judge, and I imagine in many cases, lockup could be avoided entirely with a cour…
Non-punitive my ass. The German tourist was put for eight days in solitary confinement: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/mar/03/ice-german-t...
> Brösche had her German passport, confirmation of her visa waiver to enter the country, and a copy of her return ticket back to Berlin
Sounds like all her paper work was good to go...
> she was still pulled aside for a secondary inspection by a US Customs and Border Protection agent.
Ok, that sucks but not too crazy...
> Brösche said she then spent days detained in a cell at the San Diego border before being taken into custody by Ice. The agency brought her to the Otay Mesa detention center, where she’s now been for more than a month.
What?
> US Customs and Border Protection accused Brösche of planning to violate the terms of the visa waiver program by intending to work as a tattoo artist during her time in Los Angeles.
Ok, let's say that's actually the truth. Let's say she told them "yeah I'm gonna work here". Ok, she's in the wrong, worst case but being detained for A MONTH?!
> According to ABC’s 10News, she was forced to spend eight days in solitary confinement in the facility.
?!
> Lofving also said she tried to get help from the German consulate in Los Angeles.
I wish they would have reached out to the Consulate to see if they'd supply any information about what's going on here. Maybe its policy for the consulate to not have any comment about cases though... not sure.
Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March
#206Is the reporting and media coverage on this, going to contribute to the potential harm of this being a long term impact? (is the hype creating the conditions?)
Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March
#207Earlier quoted context omitted.
10 nights in an ICE jail is very lucrative to the company that runs that jail. Can be funded by the taxes the poorest in America pay.
I'm surprised they don't require the victim or their family to pay to have them released. Make Piracy/Kidnapping Great Again.
Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March
#208Might be worth telling the tourist harassment department at the border to not behave like the gestapo?
Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March
#209Earlier quoted context omitted.
>I think the news feeds within the US may be approximately equal in their delivery of "this is good change" versus "this is catastrophic change", whilst internationally it's almost entirely "this is catastrophic change" with minor pockets of intolerance apologia. Exactly. Americans generally don't understand the degree to which the rest of the world gets the CNN 5min recap of what's going on in the US, and it's very…
When the President of the United States threatens to invade ex-allies, I don't think that the threatened people give a shit about what the American people think about it. The fact that this guy is the President means that most Americans were not against it, right? Of course most Americans don't want random people detained. But still, this is happening in the US. And one thing that I believe is absolutely clear outsid…
I don't know if that's strictly accurate. United States citizens are some of the most heavily disenfranchised in the western world. Our oligarchs have spent decades making it more difficult to vote, especially for people of color, who overwhelmingly disapprove of the current administration. In some urban areas, it can take hours of standing in line to vote, and we don't get time off from work to do so. We've also had a decades long propaganda campaign telling us our vote doesn't matter.
More people didn't vote in the last election than voted for Trump. That's not to say they all would have voted against him, but it's not really the will of the American people.
Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March
#210Countries all over the world are issuing US travel warnings. If there's an error or mistake on your visa you risk being detained by ICE for weeks on end or even end up in the Gulag in El Salvador. For European visitors, they can see the fascism miles away. A lot of Europe was occupied by Hitler while the US wasn't. The extraordinary claim that Musk's salute wasn't a Nazi salute is mind boggling. Even when people have…
So far, the travel warnings I've seen all specify specific groups targeted by the American government, such as LGBTQ+ people. News of tourists getting imprisoned for weeks or longer have been all over the news, but so far Europe doesn't seem to have actually brought out a general warning for that kind of danger. That said, the people I've spoken to (most of which aren't LGBT+) are hesitant to go to the US now. There'…
Agreed, and this is a nice way of putting it. There's a sense that shit is really hitting the fan this time.