A university president makes a case against cowardice • Hacker News Board

Re: A university president makes a case against cowardice

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Post by hayst4ck » Fri, Apr 04, 2025, 8:59 AM UTC

hnhg wrote: post #344

hayst4ck wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's false. Everything comes down to good leadership. Monarchies with good leadership very well might have incredibly effective anti-corruption techniques and competency. China is managing a billion people and their infrastructure and tech is incredible. The problems are two fold. The first is vetoing of bad ideas. No leader is right 100% of the time, and when they are wrong, someone must have the power to veto. Th…

I think people get confused into thinking that democracy is about voting when it is should be about reducing prolonged concentrations of power, because of the innate tendency for it to be abused and hoarded. So to support your point, if your culture does not support the concept of good "democratic" governance, and no one strives for the institutions and constitutions to support it, you might be better off with a bene…

Timothy Snyder would encapsulate this idea as "Democracy is not something you are, but something you do."

Which makes a lot of sense if you say the same thing about Christianity. Christian isn't something you are, Christianity is something you do.

Both have hallowed dogmas that are poorly understood by their followers, the constitution and the bible/teachings of jesus respectively.

Re: A university president makes a case against cowardice

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Post by foldr » Fri, Apr 04, 2025, 8:59 AM UTC

decimalenough wrote: post #320

kevingadd wrote: post #309

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Everything is a flip side of the same coin if you abstract away from all the important details.

Oh the right say that some things are bad? Well the left say that some things are bad too!

These lazy equivalencies only breed cynicism and give intellectual cover to the Trump administration’s executive power grab. By all means criticize the left as much as you like. But the specifics are important. The current administration’s deportation of green card holders without due process isn’t somehow a mirror image of whatever excesses of left wing ‘cancel culture’ you may be upset about.

Re: A university president makes a case against cowardice

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Post by ytpete » Fri, Apr 04, 2025, 9:00 AM UTC

CaptWillard wrote: post #92

rimunroe wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think the rough death toll of pandemics are fundamentally unknowable to some approximation? Do you think the massive increase in mortality during the pandemic was a coincidence?

Was there another pandemic whose statistics were based on mandatory asymptomatic testing (via PCR tests with deliberately high Ct values)? Was there another pandemic where 94-95% of all deaths involved at least one comorbidity, and 77% involved three or more underlying conditions?

This dying "of Covid" vs "with Covid" debate has long been debunked: https://www.reuters.com/article/world/fact-check-94-of-indiv...

TLDR: Those comorbidities are often complications caused by Covid in the first place – like pneumonia or respiratory failure. Sometimes they also include risk factors that could never be treated as a direct cause of death on their own, like obesity (which also happens to be extremely widespread in the US so it gets reported on many death certificates for many illnesses, not just Covid).

Re: A university president makes a case against cowardice

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Post by foldr » Fri, Apr 04, 2025, 9:05 AM UTC

emptysongglass wrote: post #360

hellotheretoday wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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How many of the conservatives complaining about it would support government regulations preventing people from being fired for expressing controversial viewpoints? AFAIK those complaining are the same people who support ‘at will’ employment and the liberty of religious organizations to impose more or less arbitrarily discriminatory hiring standards. So yeah, in that lax regulatory environment, your employer might decide to fire you if you (e.g.) feel the need to be an asshole to your trans colleagues.

Re: A university president makes a case against cowardice

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Post by switch007 » Fri, Apr 04, 2025, 9:08 AM UTC

_fizz_buzz_ wrote: post #330

mlindner wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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> Many countries completely ban non citizens from joining political protests, even ostensibly western countries. Which ones?

In the UK we don't discriminate based on citizenship, or even if the protests are political or not !

Protest marches - no wait, the term is less specific: "public processions" - can have restrictions imposed for basically any reason. Restrictions can be imposed if (this is just a selection):

- They basically generate noise

- May cause prolonged disruption of access to any essential goods or any essential service

- May cause the prevention of, or a hindrance that is more than minor to, the carrying out of day-to-day activities

- May cause the prevention of, or a delay that is more than minor to, the delivery of a time-sensitive product to consumers of that product

Not forgetting there are probably 10-20 general Public Order Offences that can be used against a person, such as wilful obstruction of a highway or public nuisance.

Then we also have Serious Disruption Prevention Orders (SDPOs). SDPOs are civil orders that enable courts to place conditions or restrictions on an individual aged over 18 (such as restrictions on where they can go and when) with the aim of preventing them from engaging in protest-related activity that could cause disruption. Breaching an SDPO is a criminal offence.

And the cherry on the cake: by law you must tell the police in writing 6 days before a public march if you're the organiser (which is to say, get the police's permission)

Re: A university president makes a case against cowardice

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Post by 3D30497420 » Fri, Apr 04, 2025, 9:16 AM UTC

immibis wrote: post #356

_fizz_buzz_ wrote: post #330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Many countries completely ban non citizens from joining political protests, even ostensibly western countries. Which ones?

Germany bans pro-Palestine protests (officially they're still legal, but they've been arresting people since it began and they've just started deporting people for participating in completely legal protests) but I think that's a slightly different criterion than the one you asked for.

Correct. Here's a DW video on it: https://www.dw.com/en/germany-to-deport-pro-palestinian-prot...

There is a fight over this being done with or without due process.

Re: A university president makes a case against cowardice

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Post by ok_dad » Fri, Apr 04, 2025, 9:17 AM UTC

mlindner wrote: post #275

necubi wrote: post #213

Oh hey, Wesleyan on HN! I’m an alumnus (matriculated a year or two after Roth became president). Wesleyan has a rich history of activism and protest, and not always entirely peaceful (Roth’s predecessor, Doug Bennet, had his office firebombed at one point). I’ve had a few opportunities to speak with Roth since the Gaza war started, and I’ve always found him particularly thoughtful about balancing freedom of expressio…

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> Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Re: A university president makes a case against cowardice

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Post by [deleted] » Fri, Apr 04, 2025, 9:21 AM UTC

emptysongglass wrote: post #360

hellotheretoday wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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Re: A university president makes a case against cowardice

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Post by hausrat » Fri, Apr 04, 2025, 9:22 AM UTC

rayiner wrote: post #243

sequoia wrote: post #49

A lot of Americans support these attacks on universities. Why do people harbour this much animosity towards these institutions? Is there anything they could have done differently in the past decade or two to have broader sympathy now, or is people's ambivalence towards elite universities 100% irrational?

It was the progressive push of theoretically neutral institutions taking stands on moral politics. People who were fine with universities being staffed with liberals, but neutral in practice, realized their tax dollars were subsidizing institutions that were actively taking a side in national politics. For example, universities burned a lot of political capital, and opened themselves up to a great deal of legal liabi…

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Re: A university president makes a case against cowardice

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Post by ratatoskrt » Fri, Apr 04, 2025, 9:25 AM UTC

switch007 wrote: post #365

_fizz_buzz_ wrote: post #330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Many countries completely ban non citizens from joining political protests, even ostensibly western countries. Which ones?

In the UK we don't discriminate based on citizenship, or even if the protests are political or not ! Protest marches - no wait, the term is less specific: "public processions" - can have restrictions imposed for basically any reason. Restrictions can be imposed if (this is just a selection): - They basically generate noise - May cause prolonged disruption of access to any essential goods or any essential service - Ma…

Laws around protests here in the UK are certainly problematic, but I haven't heard of ant cases where this would have been specifically used against students from abroad.