Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Talkin’ about a Revolution

drb.ie

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

301–307 of 307 posts

Re: Talkin’ about a Revolution

#301

Post by seethedeaduu »

antifa wrote: post #294
s1artibartfast wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think trans advocacy is interesting and different from gay rights because it goes beyond "live and let live" and is also an ontological battle. That is to say, it is a battle not just for equal rights, but over what people think, believe, and desire. It ask is not just for the right to exist, but to be placed within the gender heterosexuals are attracted to and accepted as no different. In this way, it lacks the li…

> It ask is not just for the right to exist, but to be placed within the gender heterosexuals are attracted to and accepted as no different. In this way, it lacks the libertarian arguments of gay rights. No one is forcing you to date someone you're not attracted to.

I find that to be an extremely common argument against trans ppl. It's very similar to the whole gay panic thing. I was surprised when I realized how worried some cis men were about being "tricked" into sleeping with a trans person. As if there are so many trans people and as if all of them want to get into their pants.

Re: Talkin’ about a Revolution

#302

Post by emptysongglass »

seethedeaduu wrote: post #300
emptysongglass wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would you blanket care about the rights of minorities? I care about the rights of lots of beings, but not minorities for minorities sake. The person isn't making outlandish claims. You can search the web and validate all of them. Liberals, as in new leftists responsible for the majority of purity spiral shaming we've seen on the internet for oh the last two decades now, are in fact responsible for their fair shar…

Try repeating the paragraph before the last to your "friend". Even transmedicalists tend to not be fond of this line of thinking. > but now it seems that time has passed. I am glad. I have yet to see any form of actually nuanced discussion about this that involves a cis person so far. Anyway, none of this is "center".

And you have illustrated my point perfectly, even down to using air quotes to describe a relationship of my own. Did you intend to go further and perhaps call me something truly awful? As I am not "center" according to you.

I am able to maintain friendships with people I disagree with, even on very fundamental things.

You capture exactly the drift that has occurred in discourse, where neither side is able to talk to each other with any level-headedness, but remains fixed in escalation, certain the other side intends their extinction.

Re: Talkin’ about a Revolution

#303

Post by mardifoufs »

damnitbuilds wrote: post #288
mardifoufs wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The interests of the Muslim community in the US. Not of Islam in general.

So the Muslim community in the US have no relation to Islam in general. Hmm..

Catering to a population doesn't inherently means that you push for all of its beliefs.

Is any politician that supports Israel to gain support from Jewish voters pushing for Judaism or Jewish (religious) values? Do you think that Judaism, the actual religion, is any more progressive with say, feminism, than Islam?

Re: Talkin’ about a Revolution

#304

Post by damnitbuilds »

mardifoufs wrote: post #303
damnitbuilds wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So the Muslim community in the US have no relation to Islam in general. Hmm..

Catering to a population doesn't inherently means that you push for all of its beliefs. Is any politician that supports Israel to gain support from Jewish voters pushing for Judaism or Jewish (religious) values? Do you think that Judaism, the actual religion, is any more progressive with say, feminism, than Islam?

How do you think the treatment of women and gays in Israel compares to that in Muslim countries?

Re: Talkin’ about a Revolution

#305

Post by econ »

judahmeek wrote: post #253
econ wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I won't call it a grand theory but I like this solution to the puzzle. https://gaby.wordpress.com/2025/03/20/wilde-democracy/

I would like the idea of voting diplomas, but ensuring that such gate-keeping can evolve over time without being gamed to slowly strip a larger & larger fraction of the population of representation over time is a really tricky problem. Thus, I think that the freedom to vote & to hold office should be enshrined in the constitution for everyone, regardless of criminal history or citizenship.

It would take a similarly isolated gov department to rate and set the difficulty. That one should probably not have a diploma.

That the system will be gamed is no real concern as that battle will continue forever. This version is at least capable of plugging the hole when enough people notice it.

The freedom to hold the generic office seems fine. For a specialized department some relevant experience and diplomas isn't a lot to ask. If unskilled employees could do a great job in any occupation we would see this in the private sector. I think it can just be left for judgement by the voter.

Re: Talkin’ about a Revolution

#306

Post by autoexec »

seethedeaduu wrote: post #301
antifa wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It ask is not just for the right to exist, but to be placed within the gender heterosexuals are attracted to and accepted as no different. In this way, it lacks the libertarian arguments of gay rights. No one is forcing you to date someone you're not attracted to.

I find that to be an extremely common argument against trans ppl. It's very similar to the whole gay panic thing. I was surprised when I realized how worried some cis men were about being "tricked" into sleeping with a trans person. As if there are so many trans people and as if all of them want to get into their pants.

> It's very similar to the whole gay panic thing. I was surprised when I realized how worried some cis men were about being "tricked" into sleeping with a trans person.

Most of the time I see the argument that people feel pressured/forced to date someone they're not attracted to it's not about men being "tricked"

https://web.archive.org/web/20211028041752/https://www.bbc.c...

Re: Talkin’ about a Revolution

#307

Post by mardifoufs »

damnitbuilds wrote: post #304
mardifoufs wrote: post #303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Catering to a population doesn't inherently means that you push for all of its beliefs. Is any politician that supports Israel to gain support from Jewish voters pushing for Judaism or Jewish (religious) values? Do you think that Judaism, the actual religion, is any more progressive with say, feminism, than Islam?

How do you think the treatment of women and gays in Israel compares to that in Muslim countries?

Why does it matter? Wr are discussing religious groups in the US. The comment I replied to said that catering to American Muslims doesn't make sense if you are a progressive because Islam isn't. But somehow catering to Jews (which I know isn't just a religious group) is different. So I'm asking, do you actually think that Judaism is more progressive than Islam? Again, the comment I replied to explicitly said that the community somehow equals the religion and its beliefs.

And I don't know if women have it particularly worse in Turkey than in Israel. Same goes for gay people, though I'd agree that I'd rather be gay in Israel that in Turkey or any other Muslim country. Not sure why that matters in the context of comparing the religions themselves though.

Post reply on HN