Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Shared DNA in Music

pudding.cool

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 66 posts

Re: Shared DNA in Music

#21

Post by footlose_3815 »

Why is it "Shared DNA" if all rappers do is sample and totally rip-off music (Logos, artist names etc) before them?

The concept of "DNA" with music goes much deeper than some lucky nobody who sampled someone's life work so they could pollute it with lowest common denominator poetry and a Roland Drum Machine.

I submit that oogling over people who steal music by sampling is not that deep, and there's deeper methods of musical analysis than "This band sampled this beat, this means they're a natural progression of art".

Every example I skimmed over was some hiphop artist who ripped off music before them.

Other artists have some shame and just copy chord progressions, but rappers went so far to just completely steal parts of the song.

Re: Shared DNA in Music

#22

Post by audiodude »

What really blows my mind is not the fact that all these songs borrow from and remix one another, but the overall "problem of universals" from metaphysics. In the realm of music, how do we even identify specific characteristics that lead to properties of resemblence? How does your brain know "Oh, that's the Funky Drummer beat" when it's played on a different drum kit or at a different tempo, etc etc.

edit: Would love to see an AI driven project where you drag a slider to "mutate" a sample until it's no longer that sample but another piece of music. A "boil the frog" type thing.

Re: Shared DNA in Music

#23

Post by heavymetalpoizn »

footlose_3815 wrote: post #21

Why is it "Shared DNA" if all rappers do is sample and totally rip-off music (Logos, artist names etc) before them? The concept of "DNA" with music goes much deeper than some lucky nobody who sampled someone's life work so they could pollute it with lowest common denominator poetry and a Roland Drum Machine. I submit that oogling over people who steal music by sampling is not that deep, and there's deeper methods of…

[dead]

Re: Shared DNA in Music

#24

Post by recursive »

footlose_3815 wrote: post #21

Why is it "Shared DNA" if all rappers do is sample and totally rip-off music (Logos, artist names etc) before them? The concept of "DNA" with music goes much deeper than some lucky nobody who sampled someone's life work so they could pollute it with lowest common denominator poetry and a Roland Drum Machine. I submit that oogling over people who steal music by sampling is not that deep, and there's deeper methods of…

Your cutoff is somewhat arbitrary.

Whatever artist you think is legitimate never did anything fully original either. The only original musician may have been the first caveman to hit two logs together.

Re: Shared DNA in Music

#25

Post by autoexec »

footlose_3815 wrote: post #21

Why is it "Shared DNA" if all rappers do is sample and totally rip-off music (Logos, artist names etc) before them? The concept of "DNA" with music goes much deeper than some lucky nobody who sampled someone's life work so they could pollute it with lowest common denominator poetry and a Roland Drum Machine. I submit that oogling over people who steal music by sampling is not that deep, and there's deeper methods of…

I agree that rap/hiphop artists are often guilty of just gracelessly slapping a beat over some one else's hook or chorus and it really does come off as lazy and disrespectful. This is especially true when the sample is of something that is (or was) already popular and easily recognizable.

That said, samples can be used in a lot of creative ways and even some very straightforward ones while still creating something unique/transformative. I still think it's a good thing that artists can use samples in their work since it does expand what's possible and I can always just ignore the low effort garbage.

Re: Shared DNA in Music

#26

Post by kaeruct »

footlose_3815 wrote: post #21

Why is it "Shared DNA" if all rappers do is sample and totally rip-off music (Logos, artist names etc) before them? The concept of "DNA" with music goes much deeper than some lucky nobody who sampled someone's life work so they could pollute it with lowest common denominator poetry and a Roland Drum Machine. I submit that oogling over people who steal music by sampling is not that deep, and there's deeper methods of…

Some sampling might be lazy, but there's plenty of impressive producers which take the art to the next level. Some suggestions you can sample: DJ Shadow, J Dilla, Madlib, The Avalanches, Statik Selektah. And as a bonus, an artist definitely not hip hop which makes beautiful use of sampling is Jens Lekman.

I will be charitable even though you called rap "lowest common denominator" poetry.

If you are genuinely interested, I suggest you look into the history of hip hop. IMO, the point of early hip hop was not to create sophisticated music, but to connect people by using sounds they were already familiar with. More important was the message and vocal delivery of the MC.

Re: Shared DNA in Music

#27

Post by __MatrixMan__ »

HeliumHydride wrote: post #3
echelon wrote: post #2

This is an incredibly cool idea. I would love to see this applied to music, but also literary structure, film, etc.

https://tvtropes.org/

I'd like to see a tvtropes for rhetorical tricks. That way every time a politician dished out a creative lie it could be mapped to a curated pile of historical references for the last time that lie was told and we can see how it worked for the lied-to the last time it came around.

Re: Shared DNA in Music

#28

Post by 999900000999 »

What a cool project. I really think music is one of our greatest examples of shared heritage.

My only comment is I think this would of benefited from some interviews or commentary by actual musicians. It felt really really surface level.

Re: Shared DNA in Music

#29

Post by john61 »

footlose_3815 wrote: post #21

Why is it "Shared DNA" if all rappers do is sample and totally rip-off music (Logos, artist names etc) before them? The concept of "DNA" with music goes much deeper than some lucky nobody who sampled someone's life work so they could pollute it with lowest common denominator poetry and a Roland Drum Machine. I submit that oogling over people who steal music by sampling is not that deep, and there's deeper methods of…

> Every example I skimmed over was some hiphop artist who ripped off music before them.

Mozart ripped of Händel. For example parts from his famous Reqiuem are a rip of of Händels Messiah. And a lot of classical Composers (ex. Beethoven) ripped of from their "godfather": J.S Bach. Altough they did not call it rip of, but learning.

Re: Shared DNA in Music

#30

Post by emmelaich »

Apparently the Smoke on the Water riff is Beethoven, sorta. According to Ritchie Blackmore.

"It's an interpretation of inversion, You turn it back and play it back and forth. It's actually Beethoven's 5th. So, I owe him a lot of money."

Post reply on HN