51–60 of 168 posts
Django still lacks typing support. Does Plain improve on this at all? I didn't see typing mentioned in the docs..
If you want strong typing in a web framework, why wouldn’t you just use a language with strong typing?
> Plain is a fork of Django Why. This makes me sad. Plain looks great, but Django's strength is its maturity and amazing, enduring community built on contributions from thousands. Forking it will at best split contributions and mean infrequent merges, and at worst means Plain users lose out on Django improvements and Django users lose out on Plain patches. It seems like Plain could be just a set of Django packages kn…
Django's origins in content probably made it hopelessly "thick" in today's world which on the server is mostly just taking in a spitting out JSON.
> Plain is a fork of Django Why. This makes me sad. Plain looks great, but Django's strength is its maturity and amazing, enduring community built on contributions from thousands. Forking it will at best split contributions and mean infrequent merges, and at worst means Plain users lose out on Django improvements and Django users lose out on Plain patches. It seems like Plain could be just a set of Django packages kn…
The fork is a bad take here as it will be super costly to maintain for no gain.
Now, if you were to change a deep layer like the ORM, that would justify it. But I don't see it here.
But let's not be negative here, someone wants to spend time, energy and resources to explore innovation for a great legacy foss project.
This is good news.
> Plain is a fork of Django Why. This makes me sad. Plain looks great, but Django's strength is its maturity and amazing, enduring community built on contributions from thousands. Forking it will at best split contributions and mean infrequent merges, and at worst means Plain users lose out on Django improvements and Django users lose out on Plain patches. It seems like Plain could be just a set of Django packages kn…
I'm a Django user and I'm happy to see a fork because while Django is mature, it's also stagnating because the project isn't able to break things by introducing new features. I don't think Plain will replace Django anytime soon but it might help guide decisions. Plain being backed by a for-profit company is also great because projects like Django could use more marketing. Vercel figured this out a long time ago.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
The author actually addresses all of those points in the about page https://plainframework.com/about/
The author discusses these points in the about page, but for me, does not sufficiently address them. My experience of contributing to Django does not match theirs, and I don't feel this page sufficiently justifies this being a fork. In fact it actually makes me suspect that Plain will/has diverged enough that it won't be able to pull in changes from Django. As a user this would concern me, as Django ships meaningful…
Kind of off-topic, but I liked the concept of "llms.txt", something similar to robots.txt https://plainframework.com/llms.txt Since so many LLMs are around, there should be a standard URI to let LLM crawl about the website/product
I don't know if Plain has a chance to succeed but I understand why it is a fork. Django leadership haven't been able to move Django forward outside of its old paradigms and every attempt, be it a fork or third-party app, counts.
Can you elaborate on this? What paradigms do you think are outdated? Generally speaking, I think Django has lagged a bit behind other frameworks. However, the continued advantage of being Python driven has left it useful in my book when working with Python data utilities in the back end. What’s your perspective here?
> Plain is a fork of Django Why. This makes me sad. Plain looks great, but Django's strength is its maturity and amazing, enduring community built on contributions from thousands. Forking it will at best split contributions and mean infrequent merges, and at worst means Plain users lose out on Django improvements and Django users lose out on Plain patches. It seems like Plain could be just a set of Django packages kn…
- Find successful open source project - Fork with "reasons" - Pour VC into helpful features, great docs, DX and evangelism - Run the Vercel playbook
We're gonna see a lot more of this.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
The author discusses these points in the about page, but for me, does not sufficiently address them. My experience of contributing to Django does not match theirs, and I don't feel this page sufficiently justifies this being a fork. In fact it actually makes me suspect that Plain will/has diverged enough that it won't be able to pull in changes from Django. As a user this would concern me, as Django ships meaningful…
Upstreaming to Django becomes very hard because he's moved stuff around. Also, switching to plain just to try it out becomes super hard because of this same thing. The idea of having a faster moving fork makes sense, but this isn't it.
Django has a "contrib" package. I could see a fork with a fast moving contrib directory, or even just the Django project doing that with an explicit call-out for that package having a different set of breaking change expectations. A bunch of features started in contrib and graduated out of it over time, would be nice to keep that going.