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AI models miss disease in Black and female patients

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Re: AI models miss disease in Black and female patients

#31

Race and gender should be inputs then. The female part is actually a bit more surprising. Its easy to imagine a dataset not skewed towards black people. ~15% of the population in North America, probably less in Europe, and way less in Asia. But female? Thats ~52% globally.

> Its easy to imagine a dataset not skewed towards black people. ~15% of the population in North America, probably less in Europe, and way less in Asia.

What about Africa?

Re: AI models miss disease in Black and female patients

#32
post #5

It seems critical to have diverse, inclusive, and equitable data for model training. (I call this concept "DIET".)

I'm calling it now. My prediction is that, 5-10 years from now(ish), once training efficiency has plateaued, and we have a better idea of how to do more with less, curated datasets will be the next big thing.

Investors will throw money at startups claiming to make their own training data by consulting experts, finetuning as it is now will be obsolete, pre-ChatGPT internet scrapes will be worth their weight in gold. Once a block is hit on what we can do with data, the data itself is the next target.

Re: AI models miss disease in Black and female patients

#33
post #3

This seems like a problem that should be worked on It also seems like we shouldn't let it prevent all AI deployment in the interim. It is better that we take the disease detection rate for part of the population up a few percent than we do not. Plus it's not like doctors or radiologists always diagnose at perfectly equal accuracy across all populations. Let's not let the perfect become the enemy of the good.

[flagged]

If I'm a black female in a remote village with no doctor, I'm absolutely going to roll the dice with AI.

In the mean time these problems should be surfaced and corrected.

Re: AI models miss disease in Black and female patients

#35

Race and gender should be inputs then. The female part is actually a bit more surprising. Its easy to imagine a dataset not skewed towards black people. ~15% of the population in North America, probably less in Europe, and way less in Asia. But female? Thats ~52% globally.

Race and sex should be inputs. Giving any medical prominence to gender identity will result in people receiving wrong and potentially harmful treatment, or lack of treatment.

Re: AI models miss disease in Black and female patients

#36

Race and gender should be inputs then. The female part is actually a bit more surprising. Its easy to imagine a dataset not skewed towards black people. ~15% of the population in North America, probably less in Europe, and way less in Asia. But female? Thats ~52% globally.

> Its easy to imagine a dataset not skewed towards black people. ~15% of the population in North America, probably less in Europe, and way less in Asia. What about Africa?

How much medical data/papers do you think they generate in comparison to these three ?

Re: AI models miss disease in Black and female patients

#37

Race and gender should be inputs then. The female part is actually a bit more surprising. Its easy to imagine a dataset not skewed towards black people. ~15% of the population in North America, probably less in Europe, and way less in Asia. But female? Thats ~52% globally.

> Its easy to imagine a dataset not skewed towards black people. ~15% of the population in North America, probably less in Europe, and way less in Asia. What about Africa?

That's not where most of the data is coming from. If it was we'd be seeing the opposite effect, presumably.

Re: AI models miss disease in Black and female patients

#39

Race and gender should be inputs then. The female part is actually a bit more surprising. Its easy to imagine a dataset not skewed towards black people. ~15% of the population in North America, probably less in Europe, and way less in Asia. But female? Thats ~52% globally.

Surprising? That's not a new realisation. It's a well known fact that women are affected by this in medicine. You can do a cursory search for the gender gap in medicine and get an endless amount of reporting on that topic.

That just makes it more surprising.

Re: AI models miss disease in Black and female patients

#40
post #35

Race and gender should be inputs then. The female part is actually a bit more surprising. Its easy to imagine a dataset not skewed towards black people. ~15% of the population in North America, probably less in Europe, and way less in Asia. But female? Thats ~52% globally.

Race and sex should be inputs. Giving any medical prominence to gender identity will result in people receiving wrong and potentially harmful treatment, or lack of treatment.

Most trans people have undergone gender affirming medical care. A trans man who has had a hysterectomy and is on testosterone will have a very different medical baseline than a cis woman. A trans woman who has had an orchiectomy and is on estrogen will have a very different medical baseline than a cis man. It is literally throwing out relevant medical information to attempt to ignore this.
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