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U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

theatlantic.com

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Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#641

Post by rattray »

lbarron6868 wrote: post #430
atonse wrote: post #141

Setting aside the obvious shock of the actual subject, I'm going to try the herculean task of bringing this back to being a HN-related topic... My guess is that there is someone named Jeffrey Goldberg in the NatSec team (or high up, it seems like a common combination of first and last name at least), and likely that they meant to add him, rather than the EDITOR IN CHIEF of the Atlantic of all people. Could this be a…

I believe they meant to contact Jamieson Greer (JG), and maybe Waltz had both of them listed by initials? That's the leading theory.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamieson_Greer

US Trade Representative

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#642

Post by jameshart »

georgemcbay wrote: post #621
joshuamerrill wrote: post #478

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because I don't know whether either of those are appropriate. There aren't many comparable breaches to this one. The closest in modern times may be Hillary Clinton's email server being used for government business. In that case, the FBI investigated and declined to bring charges, under the expectation that a jury would be unlikely to render a guilty verdict. Okay, fine. But the FBI investigated and laid out the facts…

> We should feel lucky that merely an American journalist was added by mistake. This time. We also have no idea how many times this has happened without the unique circumstances where the person incorrectly included would draw attention to the leak as part of their job as a journalist. Generally speaking, if something like this can happen once, it has probably happened more than once. We probably are very lucky that…

Right, among the reasons not to use Signal for this sort of thing is that it is explicitly difficult to verify within Signal that a contact is who you think it is. It can be a secure channel if used correctly. This shows these people are not using it correctly.

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#644

Post by throwaway5752 »

HumblyTossed wrote: post #616
simonh wrote: post #513

Steve Witkoff was on the chat while he was in Russia. There’s a vulnerability in Signal where you can set up linked devices that replicate your signal messages. You can do this by just scanning a QRcode. This is known to be used by Russian hackers. What are the chances the Russians duped Witkoff into scanning a QR code while he was in Moscow?

> What are the chances the Russians duped Witkoff into scanning a QR code while he was in Moscow? What are the chances this admin had him do it ON PURPOSE?

And why would they when they can pop Starlink and get a far bigger prize? https://www.nytimes.com/2025/03/17/us/politics/elon-musk-sta...

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#645

Post by adamtaylor_13 »

joshuamerrill wrote: post #457

I began my career in a classified environment working on government satellite programs. In my first week on the job, I was told, explicitly, that if I shared Classified or Controlled Unclassified information over unapproved channels, I would be reprimanded—likely fired, or less likely, prosecuted. It was also made clear that safeguarding the nation's secrets from the carelessness of others was my responsibility, too.…

Do we actually believe this was accidental? This seems like the most obvious “oops I leaked it to the press” I’ve ever seen.

Now Europe “accidentally saw” what the American powers were saying and it’s going to influence them.

I’m not at all sold that this was some ball that was dropped.

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#646

Post by jandrese »

dionian wrote: post #630
tailefer wrote: post #611

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should read the release that CISA put out [0]. The use of Signal for classified discussions is not a suggested use. True, it's not explicitly forbidden, but people entrusted with that access should know better. Saying that CISA approved Signal (and, in right-wing sources, saying "Biden administration CISA") is an attempt to minimize and distract. They shouldn't have been texting classified information. Full stop.…

What classified info was in the chat? The only reference I saw to classified info was explicit references to getting out of that medium to discuss classified info

I have not verified this, but reporting suggests they had targeting data down to the names of individuals in Yemen, as well as flight times and originating sources for the airstrikes, which if leaked would be very valuable to whatever air defenses were in the country. It is not clear if intelligence sources were also potentially compromised.

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#647

Post by sarcasmatwork »

joshuamerrill wrote: post #478
whattheheckheck wrote: post #466

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are you specifically calling out you are not suggesting punishment nor prosecution?

Because I don't know whether either of those are appropriate. There aren't many comparable breaches to this one. The closest in modern times may be Hillary Clinton's email server being used for government business. In that case, the FBI investigated and declined to bring charges, under the expectation that a jury would be unlikely to render a guilty verdict. Okay, fine. But the FBI investigated and laid out the facts…

Incorrect.

"Clinton has said that she never used her personal email to send information that was marked classified at the time, although some of her emails had been retroactively classified.

Comey says that's not true. Of 30,000 emails Clinton turned over to the State Department in 2014, FBI investigators found 110 emails containing information that was classified at the time the email was sent. Eight of those were top secret, the highest level of classification."

"Another 2,000 emails have been retroactively classified since they were sent, Comey said."

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/07/05/484785586...

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#648

Post by Centigonal »

adamtaylor_13 wrote: post #645
joshuamerrill wrote: post #457

I began my career in a classified environment working on government satellite programs. In my first week on the job, I was told, explicitly, that if I shared Classified or Controlled Unclassified information over unapproved channels, I would be reprimanded—likely fired, or less likely, prosecuted. It was also made clear that safeguarding the nation's secrets from the carelessness of others was my responsibility, too.…

Do we actually believe this was accidental? This seems like the most obvious “oops I leaked it to the press” I’ve ever seen. Now Europe “accidentally saw” what the American powers were saying and it’s going to influence them. I’m not at all sold that this was some ball that was dropped.

I disagree. When you leak to the press, you often do it with a planted source who "leaks" to a journalist on condition of anonymity. Doing it with an "accidental" group chat add like this signals incompetence without any added value.

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#650

Post by angrydev »

adamtaylor_13 wrote: post #645
joshuamerrill wrote: post #457

I began my career in a classified environment working on government satellite programs. In my first week on the job, I was told, explicitly, that if I shared Classified or Controlled Unclassified information over unapproved channels, I would be reprimanded—likely fired, or less likely, prosecuted. It was also made clear that safeguarding the nation's secrets from the carelessness of others was my responsibility, too.…

Do we actually believe this was accidental? This seems like the most obvious “oops I leaked it to the press” I’ve ever seen. Now Europe “accidentally saw” what the American powers were saying and it’s going to influence them. I’m not at all sold that this was some ball that was dropped.

The EU knows exactly how the administration feels about them with regards to military support. The Signal thread makes all involved look extremely incompetent. I’m not seeing the advantage if this was planned.
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