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U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

theatlantic.com

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Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#461

Post by bambax »

joshuamerrill wrote: post #457

I began my career in a classified environment working on government satellite programs. In my first week on the job, I was told, explicitly, that if I shared Classified or Controlled Unclassified information over unapproved channels, I would be reprimanded—likely fired, or less likely, prosecuted. It was also made clear that safeguarding the nation's secrets from the carelessness of others was my responsibility, too.…

No accountability or consequences for anyone is the motto of the Trump administration (or indeed Trump himself, who is a convicted felon).

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#462

Post by rahkiin »

Izkata wrote: post #455
ctrlp wrote: post #390

In my opinion there are at least two ways to interpret this: a) It's an unintentional opsec failure. Perhaps there was an address book collision with another intended user. Perhaps it was fat-fingered. This seems likely. b) It was an intentional leak. Perhaps overtly, perhaps covertly, by one or more of the channel members for unknown purposes. This seems less likely as there are better ways to leak with less blowbac…

I'd go with b: They've been talking for a while about finding information leaks, and the messages themselves seem a bit staged. They probably did it intentionally with different people, with slightly different wording, and because of which version got published they just identified a leak.

That would require coordinated competence. Testing for these kind of leaks is much easier with paper than live chats too

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#463

Post by SSLy »

bambax wrote: post #461
joshuamerrill wrote: post #457

I began my career in a classified environment working on government satellite programs. In my first week on the job, I was told, explicitly, that if I shared Classified or Controlled Unclassified information over unapproved channels, I would be reprimanded—likely fired, or less likely, prosecuted. It was also made clear that safeguarding the nation's secrets from the carelessness of others was my responsibility, too.…

No accountability or consequences for anyone is the motto of the Trump administration (or indeed Trump himself, who is a convicted felon).

The consequences will arrive by the will of the Trumpist administration.

Levied on the Undesirables only.

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#464

Post by WinstonSmith84 »

rimeice wrote: post #406
ctrlp wrote: post #390

In my opinion there are at least two ways to interpret this: a) It's an unintentional opsec failure. Perhaps there was an address book collision with another intended user. Perhaps it was fat-fingered. This seems likely. b) It was an intentional leak. Perhaps overtly, perhaps covertly, by one or more of the channel members for unknown purposes. This seems less likely as there are better ways to leak with less blowbac…

With the level of disdain for Europe in the leak, it’s hard not to think b.

There are other ways to "fake leak" information than having to look like an incompetent idiot at the end. Plus, what they said on Europe is not breaking news, they say pretty much the same on open channels - even when they face directly Europeans (e.g. last Munich conference)

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#466

Post by whattheheckheck »

joshuamerrill wrote: post #457

I began my career in a classified environment working on government satellite programs. In my first week on the job, I was told, explicitly, that if I shared Classified or Controlled Unclassified information over unapproved channels, I would be reprimanded—likely fired, or less likely, prosecuted. It was also made clear that safeguarding the nation's secrets from the carelessness of others was my responsibility, too.…

Why are you specifically calling out you are not suggesting punishment nor prosecution?

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#467

Post by ctrlp »

threeseed wrote: post #450
ctrlp wrote: post #424

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, those are the reasons for, but would be interesting for you to address the salient point of not trusting those government systems. I'm sure you can make the counterargument.

The administration has not made this argument though. You have. So why should we default to the position of not trusting those systems when every previous administration has used it without issus.

Many people are making the argument that this administration is unlike all previous administrations. I infer you disagree with that.

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#468

Post by WinstonSmith84 »

matthewdgreen wrote: post #434
ctrlp wrote: post #390

In my opinion there are at least two ways to interpret this: a) It's an unintentional opsec failure. Perhaps there was an address book collision with another intended user. Perhaps it was fat-fingered. This seems likely. b) It was an intentional leak. Perhaps overtly, perhaps covertly, by one or more of the channel members for unknown purposes. This seems less likely as there are better ways to leak with less blowbac…

"it's possible that the current admin working groups don't trust the official secure channels and assume they are compromised and they are being spied upon by their own or foreign agencies" Jesus Christ, this is dumb. Using a civilian app with civilian phones is literally the best way to get spied on, by either "your own" or foreign agencies. These people are going to get us all killed in a nuclear first strike.

> These people are going to get us all killed in a nuclear first strike.

Not sure how leaking state secrets is risking nuclear annihilation - unless they invite Putin or Xi mistakenly in their Signal Group and plan to bomb Moscow or Beijing but the coziness of the current administration with these 2 countries is certainly not making this scenario realistic at all.

Instead the reality is likely more boring: they just accelerate American decline

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#469

Post by rschiavone »

whattheheckheck wrote: post #466
joshuamerrill wrote: post #457

I began my career in a classified environment working on government satellite programs. In my first week on the job, I was told, explicitly, that if I shared Classified or Controlled Unclassified information over unapproved channels, I would be reprimanded—likely fired, or less likely, prosecuted. It was also made clear that safeguarding the nation's secrets from the carelessness of others was my responsibility, too.…

Why are you specifically calling out you are not suggesting punishment nor prosecution?

Yeah that should be the bare minimum

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#470

Post by FreebasingLLMs »

whattheheckheck wrote: post #466
joshuamerrill wrote: post #457

I began my career in a classified environment working on government satellite programs. In my first week on the job, I was told, explicitly, that if I shared Classified or Controlled Unclassified information over unapproved channels, I would be reprimanded—likely fired, or less likely, prosecuted. It was also made clear that safeguarding the nation's secrets from the carelessness of others was my responsibility, too.…

Why are you specifically calling out you are not suggesting punishment nor prosecution?

Because he wants the behavior to change, as it is a risk to the country's security. Typically these types of things at this level rarely result in prosecution; the compromise typically is a change in behavior / promise to do better / etc.
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