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Milk Kanban

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Re: Milk Kanban

#131

Post by castillar76 »

cameronh90 wrote: post #32
meindnoch wrote: post #14

Cigarette rolling paper comes in a flat pack, from which you take the papers one by one, like a box of Kleenex. Towards the bottom of the pack, there's gonna be an odd-colored piece of paper, after which there still gonna be 10 pieces left in the box. The odd-colored paper tells you that it's time to buy a new pack, but you still have 10 cigarettes' worth. Edit: found a photo of this phenomenon on r/antiassholedesign…

One of the episodes of The Simpsons I saw as a kid that had a surprisingly large impact on how I think was where Willie had cameras in all of the bathrooms to monitor if they needed the toilet roll changed: “That roll of towels is nearin' its end! She's on double red stripe!”

The toilet paper we buy now comes in individually-wrapped (paper wrapping) rolls, and several rolls in every box are wrapped in bright red paper. Those rolls have the suggestion printed on them that you put them towards the bottom of the pile in the bathroom so that when you reach for a new roll and the one you pull out is wrapped in red paper, you know it's time to go get more from the box. It's a clever design, although it does somewhat rely on people remembering to order the rolls that way when putting them in the cabinet...

Re: Milk Kanban

#132

Post by jonahx »

greatgib wrote: post #127
jonahx wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your proposal probably is an improvement (though there may be some reason it's not feasible in this case -- no closet in the kitchen, etc), but calling the original idea "very stupid" is quite the ungenerous overstatement. It's still clever, still works much better than not having it at all, and is only slightly less efficient that what you're proposing.

If you don't have a closet, it's even easier, everything will be outside in plain sight. So the office manager just need a minute passing by the kitchen to see what would have to be ordered. In a ideal world where items could be ordered immediately individually, maybe it could have some value, but in that case you might as easily have an app or a shared excel with employees reporting what is running out. But in a rea…

You are presuming a lot, and the proposed solution you are ridiculing does have possible advantages that you aren't taking account of.

> So the office manager just need a minute passing by the kitchen to see what would have to be ordered.

This requires effort on her part, and is easy to forget to do. Sure, she could schedule it on her calendar or something, but that also takes effort, and can still be forgotten. This way, maybe she sees the ticket on her desk and immediately reorders on Amazon. In fact, it wouldn't shock me if she had considered your solution and rejected it for these reasons.

> In a ideal world where items could be ordered immediately individually, maybe it could have some value, but in that case you might as easily have an app or a shared excel with employees reporting what is running out.

At least here in the US, it is the world we live in now, with Amazon. Also, once again you are ignoring human factors. People having to remember to go to some spreadsheet and put it in an order. They'll often forget on the walk to their desk, or just not bother. Whereas taking a card around the corner and placing it on the manager's desk will likely have better compliance, and be more convenient.

> But in a real world, things will be ordered in batch at a specific and fixed frequency time.

Incorrect.

Re: Milk Kanban

#133

Post by somat »

jimnotgym wrote: post #37

> When people say Kanban, they tend to think of a specific set of practices. Whiteboards & sticky notes (both almost universally virtual). When software developers say Kanban, they tend to think of whiteboards. For anyone who works in manufacturing they would have thought about replenishment first. It is completely ubiquitous anywhere where taking something from a location signals a need for replenishment.These days…

It is a subject that bothers me far more than it should, but when I was first exposed to the term kanban I naturally look it up and go "what on earth does any of this have to do with software?"

The term refers to a method to attach the logistical back pressure mechanism to the logistical items in question, basically distributing it to solve the problems of large central control. However the logistics of software development is very different, Software is mostly research and development with close to zero manufacturing and parts logistics. You would have to model each software feature as a one off custom item with a long lead time. and that is not what the kanban system is good at. Why do you need back pressure control when each item is a one-off?

So software developers came up with a system that works well for them, but instead of giving it it's own name they reused the name from a manufacturing system. thus leading to endless confusion.

Re: Milk Kanban

#134

Post by celticninja »

meindnoch wrote: post #14

Cigarette rolling paper comes in a flat pack, from which you take the papers one by one, like a box of Kleenex. Towards the bottom of the pack, there's gonna be an odd-colored piece of paper, after which there still gonna be 10 pieces left in the box. The odd-colored paper tells you that it's time to buy a new pack, but you still have 10 cigarettes' worth. Edit: found a photo of this phenomenon on r/antiassholedesign…

Phenomenon makes it sound rare, this is standard in all packs of skins

Re: Milk Kanban

#135

Post by celticninja »

somat wrote: post #133
jimnotgym wrote: post #37

> When people say Kanban, they tend to think of a specific set of practices. Whiteboards & sticky notes (both almost universally virtual). When software developers say Kanban, they tend to think of whiteboards. For anyone who works in manufacturing they would have thought about replenishment first. It is completely ubiquitous anywhere where taking something from a location signals a need for replenishment.These days…

It is a subject that bothers me far more than it should, but when I was first exposed to the term kanban I naturally look it up and go "what on earth does any of this have to do with software?" The term refers to a method to attach the logistical back pressure mechanism to the logistical items in question, basically distributing it to solve the problems of large central control. However the logistics of software deve…

You would think that, but swap manufacturing and parts logistics for user design and content, so a new feature is designed, then content is written for it, then it is implemented. Each step requires the one before it.

Re: Milk Kanban

#136

Post by celticninja »

Aurornis wrote: post #90
eikenberry wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've worked on multiple Kanban software dev teams and a whiteboard never came into play, vs. the scrum or extreme-agile teams which loved them. Kanban seems more about having tickets organized into a priority ordered queue of tasks.

> I've worked on multiple Kanban software dev teams and a whiteboard never came into play, Most teams don’t literally use a physical whiteboard, they use some software that represents the whiteboard. Do an image search for “Kanban board” and you’ll get a mix of physical whiteboards and software dashboards that imitate the same columnar style. Though one thing about software development practices is that names have be…

How can a ticket be completed to early? Software features are like wizards.

Re: Milk Kanban

#137

Post by rsanek »

galaxyLogic wrote: post #111
ramses0 wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I implemented the "three sticker rule" at my office. Every Friday, put a neon dot sticker on _everything_ in the fridge. Instead of putting a fourth sticker on anything, throw it out. Because "anyone could do it", it usually ends up that "no one does it".

Sounds good, "THREE STRIKES AND YOU'RE OUT". But would it not mean that sometimes you had 3 weeks old milk in the fridge? :-)

is 3 week old milk that old? usually when I buy milk the best by date is 2-3 weeks away

Re: Milk Kanban

#138

Post by numpad0 »

blackeyeblitzar wrote: post #82

I don’t know much about kanban but doesn’t this basically create work for others to bring the milk paper back? I can see how this works and is efficient in a way, but it removes the work for the person to monitor the milk stock.

> but it removes the work for the person to monitor the milk stock.

Why is that supposed to be a problem? It's not like the person to monitor the milk stock belong to subhuman classes and doing work for them tarnishes your karma. In fact, in many tiny companies, it's more likely to be managers themselves doing non-scaling housewife like tasks. Less janitorial work for the boss and more time for executive tasks is good.

Re: Milk Kanban

#139

Post by nextts »

CityOfThrowaway wrote: post #5

Another thing I really like about Kasia's milk system is that it is a zero-emotional overhead communication. Just take the ticket and put it on her desk, and all will be handled.

It is not an interruption, or a new todo. That's what makes it elegant.

A bad system is a slack message once you get back to your desk.

Re: Milk Kanban

#140

Post by nextts »

galaxyLogic wrote: post #53

In the office I worked it was never an issue that we were out of milk. It was that people brought in their own milk cartoons and put them in the fridge, so others could have milk too. Nice. Thanks to whoever brought it! But then nobody removed that cartoon from fridge so it started to stink, and remained in the fridge still. Then no-one in particual was eager to tackle the bad smell, it definitely was not their job.

I like the idea of a "cartoon" also meaning an expired carton.
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