Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Apple will soon support encrypted RCS messaging with Android users

theverge.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

201–210 of 270 posts

Re: Apple will soon support encrypted RCS messaging with Android users

#201

Post by CivBase »

lxgr wrote: post #88
dmix wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Cementing the use of phone numbers instead of email addresses as the primary identifiers in people's digital lives From my experience RCS is just a backup/temporary holdover system to keep SMS usable as is, since people are increasingly using regular chat apps like WhatsApp. Plus as long as spam/identity is a major issue then phone numbers will be a part of verification systems. They will use anything they can get…

There's a large split here between the US (where people largely use SMS and now RCS) and the rest of the world, which largely uses WhatsApp, WeChat, or very few others. I'm of course also just as critical of having Meta run the world's communication industry instead of Google, but that's the duopoly (or rather two monopolies split geographically) we're headed towards. Cheering on RCS as a way out of it, instead of di…

> I'm of course also just as critical of having Meta run the world's communication industry instead of Google, but that's the duopoly

Don't forget Apple with their iMessage protocol.

Re: Apple will soon support encrypted RCS messaging with Android users

#202

Post by jeroenhd »

tengbretson wrote: post #21

Still waiting on a non-Google implementation of this so-called standard.

There have been dozens, called anything from Message+ to Joyn. Most seem to be shutting down, though, because nobody used RCS since its inception from somewhere around 2009 and renewed interest in launching RCS services around 2012.

There are a few implementations on Github. https://github.com/android-rcs/rcsjta seems to be the most complete but uses an older version of the spec. https://github.com/Hirohumi/rust-rcs-client is a modern implementation.

The spec is here: https://www.gsma.com/solutions-and-impact/technologies/netwo... if you're looking to implement it yourself.

Re: Apple will soon support encrypted RCS messaging with Android users

#203

Post by jeroenhd »

vitorgrs wrote: post #146
lxgr wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's up to the mobile networks to support that (usually by outsourcing it to Google, which I'm not sure they do for free).

It's weird it's taking that long, as RCS on Android have been supported for ages here, I think even before some US carriers. I first tried RCS in early 2019.

Based on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rich_Communication_Services, it looks like Claro should support RCS (still branded as "joyn" though, so could be an outdated version of the spec).

I don't think carriers had much of a reason to invest in RCS servers up till recently, because only Android really supported it and that came with a free, third party server. Maybe now carriers will start caring.

By online statistics, Brazil seems to be a WhatsApp country, though, so I don't think many people will be using carrier services for chat. In turn, I don't think carriers will be quick to invest in servers and software to provide RCS to customers very soon.

Re: Apple will soon support encrypted RCS messaging with Android users

#204

Post by CivBase »

eknkc wrote: post #164

It’s funny that everyone bashed Apple for their lack of RCS support and now that they have it, all posts seem to indicate RCS is a shit standard at best. I have no idea if it is but that’s the impression I got. I guess it was just a talking point to shit on Apple’s approach? I don’t care anyway. Here everyone uses WhatsApp so RCS is not important but just an outsider observation.

> I guess it was just a talking point to shit on Apple’s approach?

It started with Apple promoting the "green bubble = inferior" thing. Google responded by insisting the iMessage experience with Android was only bad because Apple refused to support RCS. Now here we are.

The RCS protocol is much better than SMS/MMS. But there are also plenty of better protocols out there. Both can be true.

Re: Apple will soon support encrypted RCS messaging with Android users

#205

Post by jeroenhd »

kelnos wrote: post #50
g-b-r wrote: post #39

This is a risky clause: > R5-32-5 An RCS client having E2EE enabled shall implement techniques to detect suspicious messages or conversations.

Sounds like the standard wants phone RCS apps to do CSAM scanning as well as general analysis to see if the encrypted messages are about criminal activity. Not great.

Sounds to me like it's doing spam/phishing/virus scans on-device because cloud servers can't.

Re: Apple will soon support encrypted RCS messaging with Android users

#206

Post by madeofpalk »

bla3 wrote: post #193
MBCook wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. They’re never going away. Blue = iMessage Green = Other It doesn’t matter if both support 100% identical feature sets, it’s gonna stay like that.

Really shows how apple is only into privacy when it's self-serving.

How does it show that?

Blue bubbles don't mean privacy, and green bubbles don't mean insecure. I would presume encrypted RCS would satisfy privacy, and would remain green to indicate it doesn't support iMessage-specific features.

Re: Apple will soon support encrypted RCS messaging with Android users

#207

Post by lxgr »

jeroenhd wrote: post #196
lxgr wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd say it's the norm rather than the exception outside of the US. US operators do things quite a bit differently from the rest of the world; for example, prepaid cards without a monthly fee are not really a thing, i.e. essentially every plan has a monthly fee, but that then almost always includes texting. Outside the US, it's usually possible to receive calls and SMS on a prepaid SIM without paying anything other th…

I believe the distinction that separated the US from the rest of the world is that US carriers charged the recipient of a message, while the rest of the world charged the sender. I don't know if that's true for evrryer carrier or if it's still true today, but it made a major difference. It's also the reason apps threaten you with fees ("this service may cost you money") when all they do is send a verification SMS. Re…

It’s actually a “shared cost” model, not really “called party pays”, as far as I know.

And as far as I understand, this is all downstream of US mobile numbers not having a dedicated prefix identifying them.

They have region-specific area codes just like landlines to which calls are physically routed, and from there it’s routed onwards to wherever the mobile phone might be. That could well be a long-distance leg of which the caller is unaware, so it would be surprising to bill them for it. That leaves only the called party.

This model was then probably just carried over to SMS.

Re: Apple will soon support encrypted RCS messaging with Android users

#208

Post by h0l0cube »

mjlee wrote: post #156
h0l0cube wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least the false pretence would vanish if both support 100%

What about when either changes? Do you expect them to alternate colour schemes as each protocol plays catch up or gets more features?

I was just engaging with a hypothetical - see my other replies to siblings in this thread if you need clarification. iDevices are my daily drivers, but I don't understand all the fanboys getting triggered here

Re: Apple will soon support encrypted RCS messaging with Android users

#210

Post by bolognafairy »

bla3 wrote: post #193
MBCook wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. They’re never going away. Blue = iMessage Green = Other It doesn’t matter if both support 100% identical feature sets, it’s gonna stay like that.

Really shows how apple is only into privacy when it's self-serving.

As another commenter said: how? show your working?

You are at the very least letting this hypothetical scenario (that another random HN commenter posed) feed into your “damn Apple!” feedback loop.

Blue bubbles says nothing about privacy. It tells users which service is being used. It informs them about what to expect. Chill.

Post reply on HN